I could have said that months ago and I would just have been labeled a hater!

its always the weakest console coming out on top. happened with the ps2 last gen, the plays tation bet the n64 and the slow SNES bet the faster sega Genesis.

as for the wii programmers always find ways to squeeze more out of the hardware they are given. saying the wii is maxed out with no proof is just stupid. only nintendo knows how much the console can do

PS2 wasn't the weakest console? It trashed everything, thats why it went to #1.

The guy is from Nintendo. So, what's your point?

Sounds like boosheeet to me.

Like Nintendo didn't want to spend the extra time working on the game engine that it would take to get the game working Online (and working well) so they pull this crap story out of there behinds.

Watch someone like Capcom or High Voltage prove em other wise.

Haha, how did they manage to max out graphic technology that is almost 10 years old?

@grieve: I think he was comparing it to the XBox, which had about $100 more hardware than Microsoft was even charging for the system.

I mean the console developers have a fine line they work with. Do they put more hardware into the system and actually lose money with each sale (as with the PS3 and XBox), or do they reduce the hardware to be able to produce more and cheaper versions, but reduce the longevety of their system (as Nintendo did)?

Since all three companies are certainly working on new consoles, and since Nintendo has actually been making money off its hardware sales, and sold at least 60% more consoles then Microsoft, I seem to think Nintendo's plan is working out better.

You have to actually questions Microsoft's and Sony's plan to continue making consoles at a loss (yes yes, they do make money off of softare licensing). The comedian Jo Kim has a joke about buying his mother a Wii, and 6 months later the only game she has is Wii Sports which came with the console. Imagine the state Sony and Microsoft would be in if people didn't buy numerous games to make up for the cost of the hardware.

@hellwig, doesn't matter how much Nintendo make, the next console from them is going to be as cheesy and the games are going to be as kiddy as always.

It would surprise me that someone would be surprised of these news...

We all know that the Wii is all about the controller, graphics and processor power are really a crap for now day standards.

If nintendo does not find a way out of this it could be in trouble when Microsoft and Sony release the improved controls (far more better than Wii ones for sure!!)

The problem with Nintendo is, Wii gimick worked this time, but for next gen, everyone is going to have motion control, Nintendo will be forced to release something in the same graphic level. However the Nintendo games just don't have mass appeal like the ones Sony and MS have. For Nintendo, it is always Mario, Zelda, Pokeman then recycle. MS and Sony offer much better variety, maturity and innovation in their games.

Nintendo is fine this generation, although they will have to continue to evolve, ie try new ideas that work, to be competitive for the next. It's not all about graphics as Nintendo have clearly shown. It's about innovation and accessibility. I understand that Tom's is an enthusiast community and as one are very much about cutting edge graphics and technology, but your average person does not care as much about that. I'm curious to see what Nintendo will come up with next generation.

Agreed.

The Wii is supposed to be a fun and easy console for all ages.
What happens when M$/Sony invade their specific market with superior hardware and game selection?
You can guarantee some wicked shooter/slashing games from M$/Sony if everything pans out.

OK your all funny. I have played a Nintendo for, lol, I don't knwo 18 years now. I think Nintendo is doing fine, unlike Xbox and PlayStation (Xbox on there 2nd system, and Playstaion on there 3rd) who have yet to show me that they are a gaming console. If you haven't figured it out yet Xbox and PlayStation only want you money. If you need prof, I have paid for 3 xboxs (the one working now I fixed myself), 1 (so far) xbox360, 4 or 5 Playstaions, 3 PlayStation2, and 4 PlayStations3 (the first 3 within 6 mounts of buying my first PS3)My SuperNintendo, Nintendo64, that I payed for are still working. I have owned 2 Nintendo GameCube, when my first Nintendo GC stopped working they sent me a working one (no charge). So you have to forgive me if I the system that likes gamers. Nintendo4Life because gaming is in my soul.

Nintendo is fine. If retail graphics card prices and CPU prices(gaming systems not needing as much power as PCs) are any indication, building a system that will trash 1080p games will not be an expensive ordeal in the very near future. As much as people railed on the Wii (justifiably so in some respects), they obviously made the right decision as the populous had not adopted HDTVs in sufficient quantities. Nintendo is in a very good spot. With the DTV change, adoption of HDTVs will continue to rise and Nintendo will have the profits to invest in a fully HD system. Microsoft and Sony, due to heavy system losses, will need to keep their non 1080p systems at retail longer to help their return on investment. And from the consumer standpoint the Wii to HD upgrade will feel much more substantial than the PS3/360 with extra peripherals upgrade.

"With a complete graphical overhaul to meet today's standards" lol, maybe Nintendo standards, more like last gen "real" console standards.

btw @leafman420, ive had a gameboy color, DS, ps1 and ps3, the gameboys dpad broke and the DS got a dead pixel (not covered by warranty) and then the hinge broke. both playstations have been fine. so i'd say its just the luck of the draw, haven't found any company to be particularly better or worse than the others.

@senormortgage: your right, Nintendo is in a better position after suckering you all into buying out of date hardware. hell, you can get a 360 for the SAME PRICE and you fools still by the wii, for what? the motion controls? thats a great gimmick for about 5 minutes and for parties. so yeah, good on ya Nintendo for milking everyone for all they're worth, as you've been doing for years (how many times have they re-skinned pokemon now?).

We should be a little easier on Nintendo! That controller is probably the most brilliant idea I've seen in technology since the N64 conroller and Mario 64! You'd have to be a fool to have children in your house and NOT have a Wii for them! But Nintendo, in my opinion, was being foolish for making the Wii so underpowered to such an extent.

They're so price conscious that Miyamoto was even considering removing the speaker from the controller simply to save money!

How they could be so cheap (although brilliant1) then complain about it is surprising!

I could have told Miyamoto three years ago that the Nintendo Wii was being released with JUNK under the hood! He knew it!

The new Sony motion controller make the Wii look like it's still in development. This year E3 is definitely quite interesting. Mario you say? Well, I got over it and so should you. Nintendo can't quite think of any blockbuster game other than casual.

Bottom line for the price I would EXPECT hardware limitations and at least they are maxing it out. Unlike the monsters(ps3, 360) that some naive minds would LIKE to call "game consoles" are actually game consoles second and media machines first. Google it.

That's what you pay for and there is no talking that down. When it comes to money, Nintendo I like to compare to apple..they love the money.

Sure the Wii is under powered at this point but I'm sure there's going to be a Wii 2 which will give more oomph. I another post I mentioned I have a PS2, PS3, and XBOX 360... My over all take on virtual controls - blah! I'm still waiting for the day when the consoles get serious and allow the option to play with mouse and keyboard.

No surprise here. It was developed as a budget alternative to the other hardware/graphically heavy consoles. If super mario bros taxes the system too much than it doesn't matter how great the game is if it is unplayable.

Doesn't matter what MS and Sony come out with in this gen for motion control, the games won't follow because...

1) Not everyone will buy a motion controller
2) If everyone doesn't buy a motion controller then developers won't code many games for it.
3) If developers don't publish many games then people won't buy the motion controller. (go to step 1)
The next gen things will be different if the next Xbox and PS come with motion control as standard, but that it years away and nintendo can release a new console long before as they are in the black.

geez!!! I got a Wii for Xmas the year it came out and I'll tell you what...boring. A year later I got an Xbox 360 and I've spent far more time playing GAMES on the Xbox 360. My game collection on the 360 more than double of what I have for the Wii. I haven't even gotten to finish a game on the Wii because it's not for ME. Try to port a game like Fallout 3 to the Wii and see what kind of quality you're going to get. Some of us want HD graphics and depth in games. My experience with the Wii is woohoo..I'm waving a remote control around but in the end I'm bored with it. It sure is good for watching Pocoyo on Youtube with my 2 yr old son. That's the only use it gets now.

It would surprise me that any gamer who had been playing consoles and PC's extensively would see this as a quip against Nintendo. Although the Wii is more limited, every console has its limitations. As Miyamoto said, since the 8 bit days, part of being a programmer is fitting what you want into the specs of the hardware. Because you're working with established hardware that can not be upgraded, you're always going to be limited with what you can do. It's not quite as pervasive on the PC (see Crysis), but even there there are limitations.

Could the SMB have been more? Perhaps. Has that stopped good games in the past? Could SMB III been more? Could Final Fantasy VII have been more? Halo 3? The answer to all of these is yes. Yet, I don't think anyone who has played and enjoyed these games really cared when these came out.

I think the point that is being missed by many of the people here is that games are primarily for children and that the Wii is MUCH better at supporting the real gaming market (children) than the violence on the other consoles could ever do.

You can have the death and smut, we'll keep Mario!

Jeese people. You say that future technology (XBox and PS3 controllers) will make the technology that released with the Wii two years ago look foolish. I certainly hope thats the case, because otherwise Microsoft and Sony aren't paying attention.

That would be like ragging on Nintendo because their NES was only 8-bits and ran off ROM cartridges, which, compared to the 128-bit PS3 and its Blu-Ray is just pathetic.

Face it, Nintendo innovates, people copy. Once everyone copies, of course the originator doesn't look as good, but Ninendo will continue innovating, and Microsoft and Sony will continue copying.

I think what people forget is that there is a console for everyone and each one has its own advantages and disadvantages. If nothing else the wii has force developers to write better code across the board. With out limitations there would be no reason to streamline code of find was to do the same thing with less. there are many companies out there that expect the hardware to do what they want while having bloated software right to the core and made it alot bigger then what is needed to do the job. Once stream lined that same approach can be used on other more powerful consoles and make those machines do even more.

When Sony and Microsoft get their motion controllers, the Wii is in trouble. PS3 and 360 hardware can play cheesy family games, but the Wii can't play hardcore games like the PS3 and 360 can. The 360 is now affordable, and the PS3 is getting closer.

Yeah I'm gonna go ahead and assume you haven't played a single recent 1st party Nintendo game.

He said,(And I quote)"Its has NOTHING to do with the wii itself,making an 8-BIT GAME with the basic tool sets(meaning the way you play the game)creates limitations.I doubt the wii has been pushed to it true limit.Remember "Metroid Mther M?" How can you even think that! Besides,HVS(The creators of,the Conduit,Grinder and Gladiator A.D) does soooo much on wii! HVS said that their game called "Grinder" will feature up to "65" enemies on screen at once! So I really doubt that the wii reached it limit.He probably "Forgot!" to input the online mode and now its too late to be put in.

[citation][nom]hellwig[/nomFace it, Nintendo innovates, people copy. Once everyone copies, of course the originator doesn't look as good, but Ninendo will continue innovating, and Microsoft and Sony will continue copying.[/citation]

So what has Nintendo innovated beyond the motion controller, which probably wasn't even their idea first they were just first to market with it, hmmm?

That's like saying Blizzard innovates, lol.

Well that is quite right, the SNES was noticeably more powerful than the Genesis.

But believe what he is getting at is that a console is only as good as its developers. A clear example of this would be the PS2, quite underpowered compared to the Gaycube and the xbox; but with a gargantuan list of programmers they were able to milk that console for all it was worth; hell it is still on the market today almost 9 years later.