Source: Tom's Guide US | Keywords: microsoft, ballmer, apple, mac | Themes: Business, Desktop Computers
Steve Ballmer believes the recession is stressing the house that Jobs built.
Every company is feeling the heat during these times of economic uncertainty. However, Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer thinks that rival Apple may be hotter under the collar than most.
According to TechFlash, the boss over in Redmond sees 2009 as a year of trouble for Apple, especially in its desktop and laptop computer segments. When asked about Apple's recent market share momentum at a conference in New York, Ballmer quickly interjected and said the strong numbers Apple has seen over the last year are about to change.
"Apple gained about one point, but now I think the tide has really turned back the other direction," said the Microsoft CEO. "The economy is helpful. Paying an extra $500 for a computer in this environment -- same piece of hardware -- paying $500 more to get a logo on it? I think that's a more challenging proposition for the average person than it used to be."
While boiling down the difference between an Apple machine and a PC to a logo may be a simplification of sorts, there is truth in Ballmer's words. Apple has been using Intel processors in its machines for several years now. With this shift, the hardware in an Apple and say, a Dell or HP PC is very similar, if not the same in many cases. While many argue that the Apple price premium is worth it when it comes to laptops, making the same argument for desktops is much more difficult.
Psystar is churning out computers that use off the shelf PC components combined with Apple's OS X operating system. While the debate is still raging whether or not Psystar can legally do such a thing, the company is offering computers that run Apple software flawlessly at a fraction of the price when compared to an iMac or Mac Pro. Psystar's OpenPro with an Intel Core 2 Duo E8500, 8 GB of RAM, 1 TB of storage, an Nvidia 9800GTX+, and all the same firewire/wireless options as Apple's desktops goes for about $1,610. A similarly configured 24-inch iMac (3.06 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 8 GB RAM, 1 TB storage, ATI Radeon 4850) goes for $3,250. After throwing in a decent 24" monitor, the OpenPro is still more than a grand less than the iMac. The only major difference between the components is that the Mac uses DDR3 memory over the OpenPro's DDR2...but is that worth the absurd price difference?
Only time will tell if Ballmer is right about Apple. What is already a certainty is the fact that this shot at Apple will fan the fires of the Redmond-Cupertino rivalry. For now, what do you think about Apple in 2009? iPods and iPhones aside, how will its computer segments fare compared to the rest of the industry?
UPDATE: After realizing that the Psystar Open7 doesn't run OS X (thanks SneakySnake!), I added a better Apple/Psystar comparison. Sorry about the mix up, guys!
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Well, he has to "say something", but the overprice in Mac systems can't be denied. Anyway, I don't think, Apple's real money is in it's computers. iPhones, iPods and the App Store are strong sellers, and that can't be denied either.
I notice he doesn't talk about MS's iPod or iphone competitors, how the search business is doing compared to Google, or how IE is losing marketshare to FireFox. MS just simply can't compete beyond the Windows/Office "monopoly." Ballmer, worry about your other products before you start bashing the other guy.
Marketing 101: The big guy doesn't talk about the little guy because that gives the little guy credibility. If you are so confident about your products, don't bash the little guy but talk about how good your product is.
Apple makes the majority of its money from ipod, iphones and accessories nowadays.
Ballmer does have point. Apple has priced it's computers towards the high end of the market and in times of recession where money is tight people like myself are looking more closely to where there money goes.
Take for example the Macbook Air laptop, it cost $3000 when it first came out and Apple marketed by advertising it's size showing how it fits inside a manilla envelope. That might have worked in 2007/2008 but why would anyone spend that sort of money on laptop just because it can fit in a manilla envelope?
there is something to be said about design and the fact that psytar did not spend $$ on desiging an operating system.
god, talk about an un-flattering picture, heck even in a picture that could be considered 'flattering' the guy is fugly, that takes it to a new level
And i hate myself for saying this, but he has a point...i'd love for osx to be a legitimate option to windows, but with apple handling their hardware the way they do, it just isn't
I'm not sure about the MacBook Air costing $3000. The MacBook Air costs $1800 for the base model and $2500 with the upgraded processor and 128GB SSD. (You can get a refurbished one from Apple for $1000.) The MBA is a fantastic ultraportable laptop.
there is something to be said about design and the fact that psytar did not spend $$ on desiging an operating system.
Neither did apple. They designed a flashy GUI. The best thing their computers have going for them is the standardization. And for that matter, that's awful close to one of the worst things they have going for them too.
They need to talk about him. It is unprofessional to sink to the same level as Apple is on this. As said above. The big guy can not insult the little guy(even if its true).
That picture says it all for Ballmer
there is something to be said about design and the fact that psytar did not spend $$ on desiging an operating system.
They spend money ($$, as you call it) paying Apple for designing their operating system. Every computer sold has a legally purchased copy of OS X shipped with it.
I think this economy sucks Apple back into a time machine with the dial set to 1989. Remember when Apple was superior to Windows? Apple was completely overpriced and Apple fanatics would gloat because they had enough money to do digital graphics. Then Jobs stepped back into the picture and made Apple more reasonably priced to compete with the PC. Apple has still never ever dropped below the threshold of what a PC can offer in terms of price but they do hardware and software integration well enough that you either shell out for the good stuff or pull your hair out trying to hackintosh.
Long story short...Apple will always stay at 10 - 15% market share because of price structure. Now if they would only use some of the ipod and iphone moneys to shave prices off of hardware as well as stay current with GPU technology blow for blow...you would have a serious momentum shift happen. As it stands...Apple is still tied to the "i".
I'm gonna have to say NO. it is not. they just look pretty, but in their own unique way... i've seen better looking laptops anyhow
I notice he doesn't talk about MS's iPod or iphone competitors, how the search business is doing compared to Google, or how IE is losing marketshare to FireFox. MS just simply can't compete beyond the Windows/Office "monopoly." Ballmer, worry about your other products before you start bashing the other guy. Marketing 101: The big guy doesn't talk about the little guy because that gives the little guy credibility. If you are so confident about your products, don't bash the little guy but talk about how good your product is.
He was asked about it. You can't shy away from a question, that makes you look even more like a douche if you shy away.
I believe that Ballmer is partially right, because the difference in price will difficult people who use Windows to convert to Mac, but Mac fans won't stop buying macs, regardless of the economy turmoil.
And also, I really don't believe Apple wants to compete against other PC makers or Microsoft for the majority of market share. I think they like the place where they are now, with enough people purchasing their products so they are financially stable, even prosperous, without having to worry about things Microsoft has to (compatibility issues, monopoly, security, etc).
there is something to be said about design and the fact that psytar did not spend $$ on desiging an operating system.
Well, yes they didn't but then again Psystar still has to buy the OS, which means it's reflected on the price of the system and Apple got their share to cover said development costs.
And when it comes to design, that's the first thing to go in a time of crisis. If the product isn't downright ugly or awkward and is durable, that's fine with the majority.
Does anyone see a resemblance from a certain Star Wars character in the picture above? Could we call him "Ballmer the Hutt"?
I like both Apple and Microsoft. Although these days I lean towards Microsoft, Apple and it's fans just seem a little too full of themselves. As if buying a Mac or iPod is cool and elite? I've found much nicer and cheaper MP3 players than the iPod, iTunes is a rip off and when I want a computer I build a sweet system that runs a MS OS (soon to be Windows 7 of course).
He brings up a really good point. Who is gonna wanna pay for something that cost 500-1000 dollars more then its counterpart? PC vs Mac I think most people will choose PC and keep the extra 500-1000 dollars to pay there bills. Also to ever one that saying that mac is making money of phones and I-Pods and things thats true but as things get tougher things will change when it comes to getting that luxury item aka I-Pod vs putting food in your mouth or your families mouth I think the decision is easy and when cell phone companies offer black berry at a fraction of the cost of a I-Phone then same thing. But this just doesn't go for Apple this goes for ever company that manufacture what I call luxury technology like Blue-Ray players MP3 players and the such.
Apple sucks, OSX is worse, the only reason people like it, is because it isnt as accessible as Window or Linux
I honestly disagree with most of the Apple-bashing that seems to be so fashionable around here lately. I have been using both MacOS and Windows since the days of System7 and Windows 3.11, and I still use them both. No-one will argue the gaming advantage PCs enjoy over Macs, but everyone here that doesn't have a Mac jumps on the price difference as just cometic.
First, if I am going to spend $1k-$2k on a machine, I would like it to be sturdy, classy and smooth. Not made of cheapo plastic like Dell, Gateway, and HP do on ALL their machines.
Second, having used both for a long time, I can tell you the mac is more of a pleasure to use on a day-to-day basis. No BS security software bogging my system down, not needing Adobe Reader, and a high level of integration with suites like iLife and iWork, all combine to just get out of my way.
Third, will people ever stop comparing the Mac Pro to a $1k HP or Dell. It is not the same type of machine. It bugs me that even professional reporters can't get technical details right. Try telling someone who runs mission-critical VM servers that FB-DIMMs aren't important. Or that having a 2S system isn't more efficient than two separate ones. Or that Your HP, with its one PCIe x16 slot is comparable to the Pro's 4. Go ahead, but can I watch?
I honestly disagree with most of the Apple-bashing that seems to be so fashionable around here lately. I have been using both MacOS and Windows since the days of System7 and Windows 3.11, and I still use them both. No-one will argue the gaming advantage PCs enjoy over Macs, but everyone here that doesn't have a Mac jumps on the price difference as just cometic.
First, if I am going to spend $1k-$2k on a machine, I would like it to be sturdy, classy and smooth. Not made of cheapo plastic like Dell, Gateway, and HP do on ALL their machines.
Second, having used both for a long time, I can tell you the mac is more of a pleasure to use on a day-to-day basis. No BS security software bogging my system down, not needing Adobe Reader, and a high level of integration with suites like iLife and iWork, all combine to just get out of my way.
Third, will people ever stop comparing the Mac Pro to a $1k HP or Dell. It is not the same type of machine. It bugs me that even professional reporters can't get technical details right. Try telling someone who runs mission-critical VM servers that FB-DIMMs aren't important. Or that having a 2S system isn't more efficient than two separate ones. Or that Your HP, with its one PCIe x16 slot is comparable to the Pro's 4. Go ahead, but can I watch?
@Daeroz
If you are a fan of Apple software, wouldn't you rather spend $1800 on a Psystar that runs said software instead of $2500 on a Mac? Sure, the Antec P180 case may not be as sexy as a Mac Pro case, but the insides are what count.
If you are so confident about your products, don't bash the little guy but talk about how good your product is.
....but it's OK for the "little guy" to personify each platform in their commercials and indirectly state that if you buy the other product, you're uncool? Huh.....
I think Apple is heading the right direction. They are looking at the big pic of computer usage & not just about rivals.
I worked with MicroSoftPC and Apple MacBook daily, and in my private medical profession only with my Apple because the OSX and the functional apps Apple gives you make you like 'you work with the PC' and not 'the PC plays with you'. This is especially true for note books/laptops business. But for the desktop PC I think Apple put too high prices for mid/upper segments. For the most professionals their MacBook will do the business, but for the potent desktop PC they have to add the 'gaming potentials'. OK they have now such a premium system, but at what price. Apple should think about this. But for the peace of mind in usual business, believe me, use an Apple.
Die hard mac user hear, i have a pc at home for work related tasks, and paid well over 2000 for it, and i put more repairs on it then my 1rst gem imac-intel, im actually ordering 2 more i-macs for my small buisness, the price tag is definatly worth it.
in the case of the imac, get an hp touchsmart for example both have small foot prit
nts and occupy very litte space, and have similar specs, but i would never pay 2000$ for an HP.
It IS okay for the little guy to bash the big guy. That's the reason why Pepsi can take pot-shots at Coca-Cola but Coke never mentions Pepsi in their ads.
@dconnors
Phystar's Open7 doesn't support OS X only Vista and Linux. The reason being that OS X has no support for nVidia GT200 series cards. Apparently its coming with Snow Leopard later this years but as of now the best nVidia card supported is the 9800 GTX+, because of its similarities to the 8800 GT which was supported in the previous Mac Pro models
@dconnorsPhystar's Open7 doesn't support OS X only Vista and Linux. The reason being that OS X has no support for nVidia GT200 series cards. Apparently its coming with Snow Leopard later this years but as of now the best nVidia card supported is the 9800 GTX+, because of its similarities to the 8800 GT which was supported in the previous Mac Pro models
I updated the story with a better comparison. Psystar's OpenPro vs. Apple's 24-inch iMac. Enjoy!
-Devin