Bad move by ATI

This won't help customer loyalty.

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Not a very good move indeed, but ah well... its all about the money as always.

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Reply to DeathClock

That makes me sick. That is dirty business.

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Reply to mozzartusm

Screw the user by dangleing a carrot and then (snickers) yank it away and while enjoying it yourself advise them that they can go get their own at the re-seller's that we are supplying to!?! WTF!
ATI shouldn't of ever added the 850 to their on-line outlet in the first place...

<pre>°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o \\// o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°
And the sign says "You got to have a membership card to get inside" Huh
So I got me a pen and paper And I made up my own little sign</pre>

Reply to RichPLS

I can see someone at ATI is getting the axe for making the decision to cut those pre-orders. This is by far the worse thing you can do to customers, canceling orders without the customers permission.

Reply to armax1980

This is f'in ridiculous. Just StoOopid IMO.

I love how they mention they are just now taking pre-orders for the X800XL; well what's to say those will be respected?

Mozzartusm hope you get yours man!

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internet account) ! - RED GREEN GA to SK :evil:

Reply to TheGreatGrapeApe

We shall see, the rep that I talked to sounded like he knew what he was talking about so maybe it will work out. He says Mid March on this batch. Worst thing that can happen is they screw us to and cancel the order. Then I will just get one somewhere else and hopefully the prices would have dropped more by then. Im going to stick it out and see. The total price with shipping is around $283.00. Thats going to be hard to beat.

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Reply to mozzartusm

I'm sure they will cancel the X800XLs as well, people stacked coupons and preordered those for great prices.. like $270 IIRC.

Why if they canceled the X850s would they not cancel the X800XLs that people even took advantage of?

I would if I was them.
But theres alot of ppl waiting for X800XL for great prices that will be greatly disappointed.

Not the greatest move, it might be better for them (if they are going to do things like this) to just do it like NV does.

I just wouldnt ever turn down sales or preorders if I ran a company..

a good percentage of those peeps are going to be so pissed they will prob pickup a NV card instead.

Reply to GAME

Ofcourse they might pick up a NV card instead, this is about loyalty. ATi lacks loyalty as it seems now, thats really nasty. Thats the most important thing out there, loyalty. Both top ATi and NV cards are awesome, so now its up to loyalty (biggest part) and price (smaller part) as far as im right.

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Reply to DeathClock

Quote :

Ofcourse they might pick up a NV card instead, this is about loyalty. ATi lacks loyalty as it seems now, thats really nasty. Thats the most important thing out there, loyalty. Both top ATi and NV cards are awesome, so now its up to loyalty (biggest part) and price (smaller part) as far as im right.

Loyalty? Corporations?
Those words have no reason to be in the same 5,000 square mile radius of each other.

No corporation has any loyalty to us, so why would we be loyal to them?

The only loyalty ATI owes is the role and honor of a sale.
You dont cancel a sale. Its a done deal, and companies that do it are breaking an ancient trust that goes back since the dawn of mankind.

Sounds a little dramatic, but it does affect people that much to be betrayed in a transaction.
There will be new NV sales as a result for sure.

Its like someone selling you their house, then before you move in decide they dont want to anymore.
If we didnt have courts, it'd be bullet time.

Fighting ATI or NV in legal sense would be a tremendous waste in time, effort and money..but what they did certainly does have reprives legally if one wanted to pursue that avenue for a $300 video card.

The best option would be to find a lawyer who would do a class action lawsuit, but in this case I dont know if a large enough quantity were sold to warrant that situation.

Reply to GAME

Quote :

He says Mid March on this batch

I feel for you, man. What they should have done is transfer the preorders to their partners, like “you preordered it here, but you will get it from there.” Not like “screw you, you now have to order elsewhere at a different price…”

Quote :

Fighting ATI or NV in legal sense would be a tremendous waste in time, effort and money..but what they did certainly does have reprives legally if one wanted to pursue that avenue for a $300 video card.

You don’t need to find a lawyer. If a large enough group of ppl is affected, some law firm will jump at the class action opportunity regardless…

"The creative powers of English morphology are pathetic compared to what we find in other languages." (Steven Pinker, The Language Instinct) :cool:

Reply to Slava

They may cancel the Xl's, but fromwhat I can tell they feel like that the supply is about to pick up big time. They were offering the cancelled orders a chance to buy an XL but I dont guess that means to much, if they will do it once I guess they will do it again If they cancel my order I wont evr buy ATI again as long as there is a product that will compete against theirs

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Reply to mozzartusm

I really don't think this is such a terrible thing. Sure it sucks if it happens to you, but it doesn't sound like a large number of people were effected.

It's just business.

Does it suck? Yes. But really it's not a big deal.

Reply to splenda20

Agreed this is minor at best why get yer panties all twisted up?

Xeon

Post created with being a dickhead in mind.
For all emotional and slanderous statements contact THG for all law suits.

Reply to Xeon

Of course you dont think its that bad, but it didnt happen to you. The thing that makes this a huge mistake and totally unprofessional is that a leader such as ATI shouldnt go back on their word. Especially when its not a descion that will determine whether or not a compnay will survive. I agree that it is just business, but its really dirty low down business and I think that most people expect more than this from ATI.

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Reply to mozzartusm

Yeah, it's a small number of orders, but honestly, the people that they did it to are all enthusiasts, and bound to be on forums complaining. Cancel a Radeon 7000 order, nobody would complain or read about it. Cancel X850XT orders, word will spread quickly. And after the past short supplies of high-end cards, they didn't need to add this to the bitter feelings. Hopefull most people will be able to buy a Sapphire or other brand and get over their BBA cancelled order.

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Reply to pauldh

Problem is that I like alot of people were looking at buying a X800XL and after this I doubt I will. Why should I get in a line to buy their product that they'll likely cut off? Looks like I'm getting a 6800nu. Seems like ATI is just trying to stall loyal customers from buying available products by Nvidia. I really think this will haunt ATI for quite a while which is bad because competition is great.

Reply to KCjoker

boooooooo ATI booooooooooooo!!!

YOU SUCK! :mad:

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Reply to phial

damn that was an idiot move, why ati why?

I work therefore I am conservative.
<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com" target="_new">-={Psychotic Sociopath.}=-</A>

Reply to mrface

did you really think ATI loves you and your custom, your custom may be but its all about the benjamins, they dont care if they let you down nvidia is the same.

people cant afford to be loyal just be GREEDY FOR THE POWER.

Reply to RX8

Yeah this will definitely send some to nV.

The most important thing is that if they have to cut BBA sales in order to meet Partner's requests that's just indicative of ongoing shortages and that that hasn't cleared up.

Just ridiculous. It also means that there is no price competition against the overcharging Fother Muckers! Now it can be overcharged from the MFR down.

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internet account) ! - RED GREEN GA to SK :evil:

Reply to TheGreatGrapeApe

It's life I still don't see what the big deal. ATI messed up scratch one for Nvidia, move along now.

Xeon

Post created with being a dickhead in mind.
For all emotional and slanderous statements contact THG for all law suits.

Reply to Xeon

The customers they lose based on some feeling of lost loyalty will not be treated better by nVidia...
As far as the customer and customer relations goes, all big biz sux big dicks!

<pre>°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o \\// o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°
And the sign says "You got to have a membership card to get inside" Huh
So I got me a pen and paper And I made up my own little sign</pre>

Reply to RichPLS

I don't see it as a loyalty issue, it's a service issue. These people order a card, got confirmation at a certain price, and now they are having their card cancelled and their are told to look elsewhere. This would be forgiveable if it were a re-seller as it could be chalked up to the seller, but this is the MFR telling you to go elsewhere. I doubt that would leave a good feeling as to ATI customer service and how much they value their customers, now they want you to go to one of their functionaries at a higher price? And you expect good RMA/Support service from that too? Why bother? It's a very stupid move, any people that were on the fence about what to buy now have the added benifit of knowing how well ATI treats their own customers, how well are they going to treat you as a customer of one of their customers? Why bother with that?

While loyalty makes little sense in the market, avoiding companies that screw you over makes ALOT of sense. For these people to buy from the Oem-Partners would simply be acknowledging and rewarding that action.

The other thing is it calls into question any other order you place on ATIs website. Will you order ever get to you or will they cancel that too? I wouldn't order online from them anymore, and I bought my last R9600P directly online which was a GOOD experience. But this alone cancels out that good experience. I'd rather have the card in my hand than wait to potentially maybe get the card. Especially if these people could've gotten the card locally and they passed it up thinking they alreay had it on it's way, well that'd really rot.

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internet account) ! - RED GREEN GA to SK :evil:

Reply to TheGreatGrapeApe

I agree entirely with you. They suck! And it is a bad move on their part. I am dissapointed also.
That being said, nVidia I don't think is any better, but at least they didn't cancel customers orders.

Who in the heck made this stupid decision? They should be fired.

<pre>°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o \\// o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°
And the sign says "You got to have a membership card to get inside" Huh
So I got me a pen and paper And I made up my own little sign</pre>

Reply to RichPLS

Get over it! Seriously Grape, if you didn't buy from companies that mess up 1% of their orders, you wouldn't be able to buy anything at all!!!

They had a decision, do we piss off a couple of enthousiasts who ordered their card? or do we piss off major business partners who spend millions of dollars? If you're in a business, ask yourself that same question.

Like I said before, it sucks that it happened to them, and maybe ATI didn't handle it as best they could (maybe they could've offered a coupon as an apology, oops, i just checked the original post, and ATI said they'd give him a bonus if he purchases something else), but really, no biggie!

Reply to splenda20

Considering how much these companies spend on BS PR, this factual, proven, and acknowledged by ATI itself BAD PR will cost them alot more than those few enthusiasts, and is likely far more effective at hampering their overall sales than their Bingo Cards were at hampering nV's sales. You get over it and place your next order with them, I'm going to keep it in mind whenever I shop personally or recommend it to anyone. Their partners wouldn't be affected by the small card volume ATI kept aside for these pre-orders. It's just bad business.

Like Cleeve said in another thread, I'd recommend the X800XL if you can get it at MSRP, and now the ATIStore no longer counts as MSRP because it's no more reliable than a fly by night outfit on NewEgg at getting you your order.

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internet account) ! - RED GREEN GA to SK :evil:

Reply to TheGreatGrapeApe

here is suma funny, they can do what ever they friggin want, and theres not much me u and every ova fps whore can do about it apart from ram raiding ati`s warehouses and stealing the cards for are selves from the canadian savages who toy with us. lol canadian savages bit was a joke.

Reply to RX8

I agree totally with GreatGapeApe. A couple of you think this is no big deal but I assure you it is. There are tons of potential customers that will not forget this. Especially now with Nvidia and ATI's cards so close in performance the slightest thing will sway a consumer. Even worse is that buying directly from ATI had help to keep their prices down by resellers. Now Newegg, etc....will be able to gouge much easier.

Reply to KCjoker

Newegg Gouge? <A HREF="http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?description=14-161-125&depa=1" target="_new">Would they do that?</A>

Wonder what the ICEQII version will cost? ($718)

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Edited by Pauldh on 02/21/05 07:21 PM.

Reply to pauldh

I think we're seeing ATI taking another step towards no longer manufacturing graphics cards. I think they want to follow nVidia's model and just make chips, so they're trying to get customers in the habit of buying from their partners.

Reply to Twitch

damn that thing is expensive, that thing better cook me breakfast in the morning for that much money.

I work therefore I am conservative.
<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com" target="_new">-={Psychotic Sociopath.}=-</A>

Reply to mrface

there is no such things as good business. They're taking money away from you. ATi needs to make money just as much you want to spend it. Enthusiasts are nothing compare to Dell or Alienware, nVidia realized that fact long ago, the big money is system integrators, retail chains and low-mainstream products. Big deal so they lost the high-end market.
ATi was never kicking nVidia's ass in market share until 9500s and 9600pros came out, you can say 9800pro brought ATi to where they're at now, that didn't happen until ATi started having large price cuts on these cards.

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Reply to coolsquirtle

Hey twitch long time no see.

Yeah, I agree, but I still think they could've gone about it a little better.

They did announce back in the R9800XT days that they wouldn't be selling BBA cards for the next generation, but whoa lo' and behold the X800 series comes out and what happens, BBA is like the only place you could get one. Maybe they didn't want a repeat of the first generation of X800, but this still sucks IMO.

Really I'd prefer now if they got out of the industry but put stronger controls on their suppliers (reign in the PowerCrapper and GeXcube franken-cards). I'd prefer an HIS to a BBA card personally, and often the ATI bundle is only worth it's price when it's selling at MSRP and everyone else is selling at $50+ more.

Oh well, I just think it's a dumb move. Either don't sell them at all, or honour the sales you've taken sofar but say you won't be carrying it 'til further notice. Just bad service IMO, and definitely colours my view of their online store witch was pretty good before thanks to my experience (2 biz days to get the card, waived shipping [which they didn't mention it just didn't appear on the VISA]) I was very happy when I got the R9600P.

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internet account) ! - RED GREEN GA to SK :evil:

Reply to TheGreatGrapeApe

There are good business practices, and if ATI were to pull that with you, you're not telling me you wouldn't think twice when given a choice between 2 similarly configured systems even if it was still a Dell on the outside?

I don't disagree that the integrators make more money for ATI, but this kind of thing really gives them a black eye, in an industry that hasn't seen this much parity in quite some time. The companies (nV and ATI) are too close to risk this kind of BS over what has to be a handful of cards.
And even the system integrators like DELL and Alienware wouldn't get that many orders so easily.

What would've been the thing to do IMO is to shift those sales and refer the customers to Sapphire, etc with the price guarantee. This just shifts these people to gougers.

Quote :

that didn't happen until ATi started having large price cuts on these cards.

Actually the R9600P and R9500P/R9700P were the ones to move that market. The R9600P was one of their best movers not by droping prices but by selling it ast a reasonable price, and moving all the cards that were demanded.

In this case they've just blown a huge hole in their own credibility, which like I said is worth 20 times the amount of the cards in BS PR.

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internet account) ! - RED GREEN GA to SK :evil:

Reply to TheGreatGrapeApe

Ya now its a free market price (not that it wasnt anyway, but you know what i mean), like the NV cards.. with ATi (essentially) pulling out to please their partners.

There are disadvantages both ways.. but I would just do it NVs way to begin with.

Reply to GAME

So far, ATI's move hasn't hurt online USA prices. You can buy the X850XT for under list price from 6 pricewatch sites, with a low of $475 shipped. I can't see newegg and other biggies getting away with gouging too much until if/when these littler shops dry up on supply, then maybe prices will shoot up. I don't like ATI's move though and agree with Grape that it was probably a small # of cards and honoring the sale was the thing to do.

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Reply to pauldh

This was without a doubt, one of the most classless, ignorant, shortsighted and rude moves I've seen in all my years in the puter building business. This is just plain WRONG. I don't care if they "baited and switched" 5 people or 5 hundred thousand, it's just a bad thing to do.

Same thing happened to me on ebay. I won an auction for an old Vox Bass Guitar. The guy takes my money but never sends the bass. After I sic PayPal on him he sheepishly tells me that he sold the bass to a friend who'd always wanted it. The contract meant nothing to him. He was surprised when I sent him brutal neg. feedback. He couldn't understand why I "couldn't understand" that his "better dealing" me was "just business" nothing personal. I didn't understand and don't understand.

I don't understand it when people take your money, give their word then back out. It just plain sucks.

Da Worfster

If you don't stand for something, you'll fall for anything.

Reply to Worf101

Amen worf.

 Woohoo!! I am officially a Member !!

Reply to Anonymous

True, worf, but they don't take your money till the item ships...Still doesn't right the wrong, just a technicality...

<pre>°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o \\// o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°
And the sign says "You got to have a membership card to get inside" Huh
So I got me a pen and paper And I made up my own little sign</pre>

Reply to RichPLS

Forum Graphic & Displays : Graphics Cards - Bad move by ATI

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