Reliability of DIY PC's?

They are about the same.
Some build up PC manufacturers are using the same components as a DIY PC.

Building you own always comes with the possibility of acquiring a defective part but the same thing can happen with a prebuilt from Dell or any other major brand name dealer, but the difference is Dell preassembles the machine then tests it as a whole operating unit, before its shipped.

If in their test phase a part fails they simply replace the defective hardware with another and test again, easy on their part cause the replacement part is right there on hand to swap out.

Their components are of a descent quality but not top of the line unless you're after their very top end computer, their hardware is mass produced and if they have a bad one its no big deal to them, they just swap it out and the consumer never knows the difference.

Building your own and ordering your parts online gives you the option of the level PC you want to build, budget, mainstream, or high end, so basically each hardware level has its pretested quality targets, and as always we get what we pay for, but we do expect it to work, and if it doesn't we don't have a replacement on hand and the RMA game begins.

Thats the downside and the downtime of building your own, however the upside is well worth the trouble, the satisfaction of building your own machine outweighs all the possible trouble that may or may not happen.

Having a machine built for you and researching the individual parts if you ventured inside the machine to find the brands and model #s of the hardware it was constructed with can be seriously disappointing if you research what it all amounts to, whereas when you build your own, you know whats in it.

I presently have 2 machines up and running the oldest has never had the first problem and is presently about 3 yrs old, the newer is 1 1/4 yrs old specifically built for gaming and is on her 3rd M/B, the first M/B failed after three months and was RMAd and replaced, the othe M/Bs were just improvements for overclocking purposes, no failures there.

Theres always the possibility of getting a bad component, sometimes it can happen in shipping, sometimes the component failure occurs and if it had been pretested a few minutes longer by the factory that made it, it would have failed and never left the factory in the first place, and that can also apply to Dell, they've had to replace their entire machines, but you usually don't hear about that kind of thing, Dell doesn't advertise that possibility.

RMAing a part usually cost less than RMAing an entire computer, but what do you do if your Dell fails? Do you not still have downtime? Or does Dell have instant transport capability now, so you can beam it back to the factory for instant repair like Star Trek?

No They Don't!

I hope I've given you some food for thought, and if you decide to build your own, feel free to PM me anytime, I'll help you all I can. Ryan

What brands? What BIOSes? What memory?

There is a bit more research involved with DIY pcs and this can give the perception they are less reliable, same goes for PC in general actually, Apple would have you believe that PCS never work.
I've built my own pcs since 1995, I've never had problems that weren't software, or cheap hardware.
Over the years I've learned what brands to avoid, how to flash bioses, research proper memory population, etc, after that my current system... even overclocked to the hilt, has been as rock solid as anything I've ever seen.

Same goes with pre-built, how "good" they are is usually directly related to how much they cost, not to mention the user itself.

I've found that for experienced DIYers, DIY is not only less expensive in most cases but far more reliable because they know more about what happens when you do what.

There is an enormous software library out there for pcs, not all of it is foolproof, far from it, yet invariably the PC itself as an entity, and/or the "Windows" is usually to blame. There are an untold amount of brands out there making all types of peripherals but if they fail, again, the "PC" or, Windows is to blame. To be 100% honest, Windows XP, Windows 98, Windows 2000, and even Windows 95 OSr2 have all be rock solid for me once I learned what to avoid, and when some ****head hacker or malware wasn't trying to mess with me, or I wasn't putting crappy hardware in it.

We could get 100% testing and 100% ruthless hardware/software control over every single item that could ever be put into a PC, but then we'd have an overpriced MAC with 1/10000th of the software library.

Yes Windows has its own problems, of course it does, but I rarely run into one that is truly "Windows" fault and not the fault of the buggy software I'm trying to run on my impossible to predict combination of hardware. You don't get that with MACs, but you also get 1/2 the system for twice the amount. Once apple drops their prices and gets a gaming software library like the pc does, I'll consider them, until then I don't care how white and pretty they are.

I didn't mean to turn it into a mac flame, they are what they are and in my opinion appeal to a completely different market anyway. As far as DIY goes, it's not fair to say they are "Unreliable" when it, like any other component, completely depends on the manufacturer (yourself) and parts like anything else.

I built my first computer 3 years ago and not a single piece of hardware has crapped out on me. I may be lucky, but I also purchased a quality PSU and motherboard.

The best part, at least for me, about building my own computer is I can troubleshoot my own problems. I don't have to call some random customer service rep and spend hours just trying to explain the simplist of issues. I make a quick post on forums or surf the web and can problem solve most issues.

The only think I regret....is buying an Intel mobo and not knowing you can't OC them... Won't make that mistake again.

Of the DIY PCs I've built, none have ever croaked for reasons that:
A) would not have croaked a pre-built unit (e.g. a massive power surge, or an eventual HD crash)
-AND-
B) were not caused by inferior parts I probably ought to have known not to use (such as a $15 PSU about 6 years ago).

They have also never died of problems that afflict mass-market PCs, such as overheating, and all have been upgradable, whereas many prebuilt boxes are very limited.

If a pre-built unit croaks, the MTTR is going to be a lot longer (days or even weeks) than if your DIY unit fails. You won't be confined to a tediously scripted troubleshooting process, and won't need to be concerned about the competence of the Rent-A-Geek who has the service contract. Also, you won't need to worry about personal data being accessed by random others.

With a little bit of research there aren't any real risks involved in DIY.
However, DOAs happen to the best of us.
DOAs aren't that big of a problem though, if anything they are preferred to something that is poor quality and happens after the warranty period.
If a sketchy company told me that they could guarantee me a non-DOA unit, that doesn't mean anything to me. I want to work over time.
I've repaired many many many pre-built systems and it's always due to inferior parts. However, I won't point out a specific company since I've repaired as many Gateways as I have HPs or Dells or anything else. One constant I have noticed though is that vast majority of repairs are on the "cheap" systems. That are typically built when corners are cut, either in component quality (usually) or the level of detail/inspection put into their construction.

But your talking Apples and Oranges here... I got a million dollars for you if you can send me a Dell with a factory installed P5K in it. You want a rock solid DIY computer - put a Intel board in there. One that has been out for awhile (nothing brand new).
Wife's - Intel DH965WH in an Antec Sonta 2(w/antec PSU), E6300, 2x512 Mushkin running Vista Home Prem. ROCK solid - never a problem.
Mine - Abit IN9-32 Max (brand new board w/ brand new infant bios) see my sig for the rest. Now I've never had a hardware failure on this stuff, but bios issues with Ram compatiblity for sure... It's stable now but it was "fun" getting it going.
My point is your listing "state of the art / cutting edge" stuff here and then trying to compare it to some tried and true Dell. Doesn't wash.

The only problems I have had (been into computers from the 80's) was the same anyone runs into...mostly a bad cap on the MB that fails just after the warenty runs out or just befor.

Asus in the early 2000's gave me the most parts problems with both caps and chipset fans.

As for your hardware problems....they are probibly related to the first bad PSU you had.
It only take one of those to mess up everything else.

Maybe I was just naive, I thought I would buy these great parts, hook them all up and have this killer machine at a fraction of the cost of a similiar system. I never expected all the issues I am seeing, nor did I have much experiencing troubleshooting some of the issues I mentioned before. One thing I can say is that my PC building/troubleshooting knowledge has increased quite a bit. However, I am humbled just when I feel a little confident, like when the P6N would not post, all fans spin-up, but just a blank screen. I worked on that issue for days, never did figure out what part was bad, I assumed the motherboard (again), and got the P5K. While the P5K did post, days later bios corruption. Was that becuase of an exisiting faulty component, or was it just bad luck again, I have no idea still. It's issues like this, maybe I am amextreme case, that makes DIY not seem to be worth it. I have an old laptop I can use while my PC is down, but if I didn't, these issues would have been unacceptable as we are all addicted to our PC's I was hoping to OC my e6420, but for the time being I will settle for a stock PC that functions until the next issue, yes I pessimistic at this point.

I just linked the first 4 GB kit I found. Generally speaking 4 X 1 GB is going to be cheaper than 2 X 2 GB... but still... my point remains valid. Dell rapes you on the upgrades.

If you put good parts into your computer and know what you're doing putting them in there, you'll get at least as much problem-free service as with any consumer OEM machine. Here are the reasons why some DIY builds have trouble compared to OEM ones:

1. Overclocking. This puts a much bigger strain on everything inside the computer due to higher power draw and higher thermal dissipation. OEMs disallow overclocking for the most part and they will not see this issue. I'd be willing to guess that overclocking is the single biggest reason that some DIY builds have lower reliability than some OEM ones.

2. Inadequate airflow/ventilation. The OEMs know how much air has to flow by what to keep temps reasonable and make it happen. Most DIYers just wing it. Monitoring temps is critical for a DIY to make sure everything gets enough airflow.

3. Much more prevalent use of top-end parts. The top-end parts like QX6800s and GeForce 8800 GTXs are clocked to about the maximum of what they will do. They thus will produce much more heat and draw and give off many more watts than the low-end stuff seen in OEM PCs. The parts are not necessarily designed for constant usage like the lower-end stuff can handle due to lower TDPs, voltages, and power draws. The high-end parts will literally burn out much quicker than low-end ones will. It's the same principle in how a Ferrari Enzo will prove to be far less reliable than a bog-standard Ford Focus or any other common people-hauler. The Ferrari is designed for intermittent operation only while the cheap car is designed to be run daily.

4. Incorrect combinations of components. Putting an underpowered PSU will cause problems, as will clearance issues resulting from trying to put too much or the wrong size of parts in a build. The OEMs can and do have special versions of things like motherboards and GPUs made to fit their case that the DIYer doesn't have access to. The DIYer would have to resort to modding and other non-standard changes that can cause problems with ventilation or noise.

5. Using substandard or used parts in an attempt to build a machine for less than what it should really cost. Some cheap stuff is okay, but some has trouble written all over it. Ditto for used parts. I never used any used parts that I haven't known what's happened to them since they were new. This pretty much limits me to bumming parts from friends and relatives that I've probably installed myself. Stay the [b][/b]HELL away from eBay as a fair bit of the stuff on there, especially high-end stuff, has been abused or otherwise damaged and WILL cause problems.

Putting together a sane build with good-quality parts, making careful part choices, and ensuring good airflow will result in an excellent build. I've built three computers and none have had any issues beyond a dead case fan. And these machines are on 24/7 generally running at 100% on all cores, either folding or doing CFD sims in a lab.

Good thoughts, MU, nicely put. To summarize the good thoughts of others here - yes, it does take a little luck because parts have known to be delivered DOA to the DIY'er.

Whether you should DIY depends on what kind of computer you want. If you don't need a gaming machine, buy a Dell. If you want a gaming machine but don't want the hassle of building one, buy a Dell gaming machine. Be warned, however, that pre-built gaming machines are going to cost you a lot more than if you built it yourself. If you're uncomfortable fixing your own problems, buy a Dell (or their ilk).

However, if you enjoy making the exact machine you want at the exact price you can afford, DIY. If you're comfortable with being your own customer support or you have friends that can do it for you, DIY. If you're the adventurous type, DIY. If you're a gamer that doesn't want to be overcharged for a top-notch gaming rig, DIY.

For reasons in the paragraph above, I became a DIY. I didn't know a heck of a lot about computers before I built my first (with help from a friend), but I sure do now. And it's because of sites like this that makes growing knowledge in this area much easier. There are a number of answers already out there on the web and through forums like this one.

As for which is more reliable, I say pre-built in the beginning because most of the work has been done for you already. However, in the long run, a properly built DIY machine beats an OEM machine any day of the week and when something does go wrong, you don't have to talk to Habib Rashan in India who can barely speak or understand English, go through a menu of questions until he runs out of answers or until you hang up in frustration.

Yes, whatever you do, do not skimp on the PSU. It's perhaps the most important part of the PC - the one that keeps everything else happy.

Hearing all of the good has helped to reassure me a tad. However, even when I install my second P5K tomorrow, I will always have the thought in the back of my mind, that one day another blank screen, bios failure, PSU failure, etc will occur. That is what bothers me so much, its hard to enjoy something after it has let you down so much. I just wish there was some way to be 90-100% sure that your DIY'er is stable and will last some time, but I know that's a silly hope. I just hope after tomorrow, when install, what seems to be like the 100th motherboard that I have a system that will last, at least for the rest of this year. With my laptop, I never have those feelings, its like I know when I push power, within a few mins I can check my email and such. I have had no such confidence in my build. I am not going to quit on it, I have 1200 bucks, well after all the RMA's close to 100 bucks invested in it. I just hope I come back one day and post some good, instead of more bad.

Thanks for your replies, they were all well written reponses.

/Cheers

looking at the programs, at least some of those you listed have to be installed on any new computer, and then there is the reinstall on most any computers.

I build all my PC's, the advantage being able to overclock and being able to upgrade any component inside the PC. I have upgrade processors 1GB+ more, meory 1GB+, video cards, etc. I certainly couldn't do that with a Dell. You get better at troubleshooting as you get more experienced and you do not have to pay the stockholder, the accountant and CEO when you build your computer, so the result is better parts, better computer.

The guy who mentioned environmental factors may be on to something. Do you have a carpeted floor? In our office I always get static shocks touching metal after walking on our carpet for even a few metres. When building my PC I took my shoes off and frequently grounded myself touching a radiator. I think professional technicians wear wrist-bands connected to the ground. That said I have never to my knowledge damaged a part through static electricity, though I've read it may be possible such damage doesn't show straight away.

Built 2 PCs, one of which my landlady is using for the past year and 1/2. No problems. I did not find these PCs cheaper than equivalent Dell, more like the opposite in fact. (Reason for building system 1 was small-form-factor, system 2 to combine performance with near silence). Perhaps therein lies a clue. Like already mentioned, could skimping on parts, particularly PSU and memory, be the problem?

I was very close to taking it to the local PC building business. But, as mentioned, I know the CPU is at fault. When I get a new one and if I have any other major issues, I will take it to them. I have wasted too much time already, wife is giving me the "stare" cause I have been doing nothing but trying to get the PC to work for the last month.

I have 2 DIY rigs that have had no non-user induced problems running strong for over 5 years. I have only 1 of 8 PCs (a server) that is completely factory built (DELL). 5 are completely DIY and 2 are DIY modified. The Factory built I have had have been very reliable but I have had no bad experiences with DIY. And of course, once you are comfortable with building them fears of a malfunctioning part are greatly diminish. The real risk to reliability is that it is hard to keep your hands off a working unit because there is always something that can be improved! 8O

i actually asked if I could get the old parts i was upgrading from (work laptop D620) and the rep said "....uh.....no". I said, "why not? I am paying for both right?"; his response "We don't do that"