Vista official SP1 = worse than before!
Forum Windows Vista : Vista General Discussion - Vista official SP1 = worse than before!
I'm a MSDN subscribed member and downloaded the "official" SP1 for Vista x64.
The Good
1. Install took about 20 minutes and no issues reported.
The Bad
1. No performance improvements at all (fraps reports same in all games, Crysis, GTR2, rFactor, COD4, etc.)
2. More DX9 games are crashing with BSOD or "Stopped Responding" (never got BSOD prior to SP1)
3. Security is still "in your face" so keep the UAC disabled
The Neutral
1. DX10 games perform the same (FSX, Crysis)
Overall experience with the official SP1 is WORSE NOT better on my Vista x64 system (quad core Intel 9650 4GB RAM and nVidia 8800GTX).
Based on the threads in this forum (11231) vs. WinXP (386855) it looks like most folks are doing the smart thing and not upgrading to Vista. If you WinXP folks were waiting for SP1 to "fix" Vista, well it doesn't, has only made DX9 games worse on Vista.
For gaming, I'll stick with WinXP and the soon to be released SP3 (which I'm hesitant to install based on Microsoft's miserable record with Vista SP1).
For those that want to continue with Vista SP1, it will become available to the masses in March via Windows Update -- but you have been warned.
Have you tried re-installing vid card drivers?
The only real speed improvements reported with sp1 were in the file copying/transfer dept, IIRC.
Hope you find a fix. That's a bummer.
I know you are disapointed but XP had six years to amass that user base/thread count - and threads usually come up from *cough* problems. Hardly much of a measure of anything.
Having said that I will hold off awhile before getting SP 1. Thanks for the input.
Message edited by notherdude on 02-20-2008 at 06:40:44 PM
notherdude u have an old hand. Having an old hand doesnt make sence. Cuz its old. get a new one.. seems like ur hand doesnt understand what it is writing. So placve it in ur rig instead of vista human orgnoids will amke more sense
Reply to notherdude
I upgraded to Vista because of SP1, I've seen a massive performance increase from the RTM release of Vista. A service pack does not perform magic, of course you won't see a huge difference in games that's upto Nvidia & ATI.
I think the real issue for me is that DX9 games are now crashing that didn't prior to Vista SP1.
I had most of the nVidia KB hot fixes installed so I didn't expect to see much of an performance improvement, still about 10-20% slower overall than WinXP.
Files copies, only with USB devices was this a problem under Vista -- standard disk I/O was fine.
Ok, seems that just about all my DX9 titles are crashing with memory dumps now -- only variable is the installation of SP1. Prime95, MemTest 86, 3DMark06, SiSoftware Sandra burn in tests were all good so I've "cleared" this as being a hardware issue.
Going to wipe Vista x64 SP1 and go back to WinXP. This isn't the first time Microsoft have released an SP that made matters worse, not better. From what I understand from "the inside" there was some "debate" between releasing now or in June. Think they should have waited as this release will only hurt Vista sales even more, not help.
I think Vista has to be the worst OS Microsoft have ever released. DX10 games do at least seem to continue to work.
Anyway, SP1 will be made available to the public in March via Windows Update site.
Maybe I'll revisit Vista when they release SP2, but my hope is that Microsoft stop attempting the backwards compatibility game and just write a new OS from ground up without any form of backwards compatibility. Most people I know that have Vista have either removed it or have a dual boot to WinXP. Since so many do dual boot, then it's pretty clear that compatibility was NOT achieved in Vista so why even bother adding the layers and layers and layers of code to "try" (and fail in most cases) and retain compatibility.
For the heck of it why don't you uninstall SP1 just to confirm that's the problem.
notherdude u have an old hand. Having an old hand doesnt make sence. Cuz its old. get a new one.. seems like ur hand doesnt understand what it is writing. So placve it in ur rig instead of vista human orgnoids will amke more sense
Reply to notherdude
Done, uninstalled back to pre SP1. DX9 games are working now - I should be more specific "working as well as they were before SP1" -- still get "Stopped responding" but usually only when exiting the DX9 game -- which is far better than BSOD and memory dumps that I got in SP1.
For those wanting to uninstall official SP1: Control Panel | Programs and Features | Tasks - select "Installed Updates" -- now locate KB936330 and select Uninstall.
That has confirmed it for me -- being back at square one with Vista x64 is not exactly where I wanted to be so it's going to get wiped in favor of WinXP.
I do recall a lot of folks saying they're gonna wait for SP1 for Vista before upgrading -- all I can say is good luck and don't wipe out your WinXP partition.
Message edited by V8VENOM on 02-21-2008 at 10:18:33 PM
Is anyone else reporting this problem yet?
I guess we will see for sure after the main release. But so far this is the first I have heard about it.
notherdude u have an old hand. Having an old hand doesnt make sence. Cuz its old. get a new one.. seems like ur hand doesnt understand what it is writing. So placve it in ur rig instead of vista human orgnoids will amke more sense
Reply to notherdude
Yeah folks, please do chime in with your Official SP1 experiences. Surprised someone at Tom's hasn't done a review on SP1 yet?
| V8VENOM wrote : Ok, seems that just about all my DX9 titles are crashing with memory dumps now -- only variable is the installation of SP1. Prime95, MemTest 86, 3DMark06, SiSoftware Sandra burn in tests were all good so I've "cleared" this as being a hardware issue.
|
Look at this fool, complaining, crying and whining. If you dont like vista, why dont you buy a Mac, Linux, Unix and use them. OR better yet, write your own Operating System that will work with any software ever written for any platform, it will put you to bed, print your own money, cook for you, clean for you, give you sex, etc.
Hey, do you think Microsoft is God? Vista is made for the next generation software and hardware. Microsoft does not guarantee compatibility with old software and hardware. Why are you complaining SP1 is messing up ur DX9 games in Vista? Does microsoft guarantee SP1 will improve your DX9 titles running in Vista? NO. Did the game publisher guarantee your game will work in Vista? NO Did you make a big deal out of nothing? YES
If you want everything to be running smoothly, set up dual OS on your computer. Play DX9 games in XP, and DX10 in Vista. Problem solved.
"Wiser_Than_U" -- oh brother!! I'm sure many have their "ignore" buttons enabled with any of your responses. Foolish, yes that describes your response very accurately.
i just had sp 1 install for me today. i had already benchmarked my machine pretty thoroughly and now my scores seem locked. when i run an over clock. i get next to zero improvement running 3 gtx's. tring to see if i can fix matters but even with a 3.66 overclock my 3dmark was within 50 points of stock 3ghz score. prior to sp1 i would be scoring in the 18k range at 3dmark default only to be getting the high end of 12k regardless of cpu clock now post sp1. anyone else having trouble like this?
http://service.futuremark.com/compare?3dm06=6357314
Reply to atomicWAR
Sad I was really hoping this would make vista better too bad, I guess Im sticking with xp and ubuntu.
Antec NeoPower 550 TrueWatts.
Reply to Eternal
I haven't had those problems with DX9 games. Programs ran slower for a lil while, but that was expected since it was mentioned in the release notes that the Prefetch would be cleared since they've slightly changed the way it works to improve speed. Now all my programs are starting up a lil faster. Then again, my computer is a good computer so that nonsense about 10-20% slower doesn't even apply.
If your computer is that much slower that you can't endure the wait then you probably need to upgrade...
If the 10-20% means that a program that took 5 seconds to start is now taking 6... then your probably being too picky...
| Eternal wrote : Sad I was really hoping this would make vista better too bad, I guess Im sticking with xp and ubuntu. |
Give it a little time. The real story will come when millions are trying it. Till then just wait.
notherdude u have an old hand. Having an old hand doesnt make sence. Cuz its old. get a new one.. seems like ur hand doesnt understand what it is writing. So placve it in ur rig instead of vista human orgnoids will amke more sense
Reply to notherdude
Can you say OOPS! Makes ya wonder how Microsoft could get it so so wrong after 6+ years of resources and many millions of dollars tossed at it.
http://www.engadget.com/2008/02/20 [...] ugh-for-s/
http://www.news.com/Microsoft-pull [...] 31299.html
http://forums.microsoft.com/TechNe [...] &siteid=17
Vista is going to be a pile of dog pooh even at SP99. At this point, I think it has definitely exceed WinME as being the worst OS to date.
Interesting, looks like current Vista SP1 Project Manager has been "rotated".
Reboot cycle anyone? Forced to reformat -- lovely! Great job Microsoft.
Message edited by V8VENOM on 02-23-2008 at 12:29:18 AM
so i have had a day to play with the sp1. i am still yet to find any fixes for my horrible graphix performance though on a postive note i have noticed the fixs have solved some minor web related issues and program load times. as a gamer those are nice extra's and all but i want my gpu performance/scaling back. i am very close to uninstalling sp1.
http://service.futuremark.com/compare?3dm06=6357314
Reply to atomicWAR
If you search enough, you'll find many people still complaining about Windows XP as well. How many complained that SP 2 "broke" their Windows? How many people put off installing SP 2 because they thought it was more buggy than the original?
It's the same old story... over and over again. Many people do have problems, but then again many people don't. The problem is, you almost never hear from someone that isn't having problems....
Can we just auto ban apple fans? I love the fact nobody even pays you to do this. Go have fun paying more for less dumbass.
>Thermaltake Toughpower 650w >PALiT 260 GTX (216) @729/1458/2520
Reply to LAN_deRf_HA
I really don't understand the big deal "worst OS since ME"? I have Vista 32-bit and I personally like it more than XP for small few reasons. I really don't see why people hate it so much. This coming from a pretty solid gamer too.
Reply to bildo123
| bildo123 wrote : I really don't understand the big deal "worst OS since ME"? I have Vista 32-bit and I personally like it more than XP for small few reasons. I really don't see why people hate it so much. This coming from a pretty solid gamer too. |
You are not alone my friend! Vista is actually very popular among gamers and enthusiasts, though of course there is a very vocal anti-vista group too. Interesting poll at Anandtech in the Operating system section shows Vista with a slight lead after several hundered votes. The poll simply asks what OS you are using, XP or Vista. This does not reflect the trend among the general public where I'm sure there are still many more XP machines out there, but it does show a trend among at least one segment of the techo-sophisticated. Word is that Vista is a fine OS on new and powerfull machines. Vista 64 is clearly the 'hot thing' in OS choice ATM and probably will take over the gaming world, IMHO, with RAM so cheap and systems now supporting 64.
War Vista 64!
notherdude u have an old hand. Having an old hand doesnt make sence. Cuz its old. get a new one.. seems like ur hand doesnt understand what it is writing. So placve it in ur rig instead of vista human orgnoids will amke more sense
Reply to notherdude
Another thing to that people who complain about vista do is don't really mention their hardware specs. Does XP work on my Ma's old Compaq Armada M700? Yes, does it work well? No. Is XP a bad OS because of that No(Put 2000 on it). Most people that complain about vista are usually running a CPU thats a couple generations old and have roughly 512MB~1GB RAM(Lets get real people a 2x1GB set can be had for around $50). What the vista complainers are doing is exactly what I mentioned in my laptop example. Just because it doesn't work well on that machine doesn't mean it's a bad OS. Just my 2 cents but nobody likes pennies.
Reply to bildo123
Just wanted to say I have Vista 64 and no problems at all. I am afraid to upgrade to SP1 because Vista runs my games great as it is.
| chetbango wrote : Just wanted to say I have Vista 64 and no problems at all. I am afraid to upgrade to SP1 because Vista runs my games great as it is. |
Well, if what the OP mentioned is true globally and not just his system I would sit back and wait for the general populous to respond on there reviews. I'm sure there will be quite a bit of talk when it's officially released.
Message edited by bildo123 on 02-27-2008 at 08:01:08 PM
Reply to bildo123
My CPU is a Quad Core QX9650 @ 3.6Ghz, 4GB RAM, 8800GTX, 4 10K 150GB Raptors.
Reviews of SP1 are already coming in -- see my links (TechNet)
Using a technology site as a sample basis for Vista vs. XP popularity isn't very meaningful. Data gathered from major web servers (like Google) would indicate Vista isn't being used much at all. Most of us hardcore folks into personal computer technology try to get as many flavors as possible -- I use WinXP, Vista x64, OS X 10.5.2. To limit a poll/survey to either/or is just not realistic.
I still use Vista x64 for software development work. WinXP is primarily for games (maybe some testing). OS X is for surfing, video/audio production, Email, also software development, and now it is being used for more and more games.
Perhaps Vista 32bit (x86) is less problematic, don't know since I've never used the 32bit version. But if you follow those links, it would appear that all flavors of Vista have serious issues caused by SP1. Getting stuck in an infinite reboot loop is certainly NOT a good thing for what many had hoped would be the "real next Microsoft OS".
The infinite loop problem was VERY limited and is now fixed - don't forget SP 1 isn't even released yet to the public. This is a speed bump. a minor glitch, you make it sound like a freaking crisis.
The list of apps that would not run or else caused Vista to loop is published - fixes in for all but 2 obscure apps when I last checked.
Your anti-Vista agenda is getting tiresome. I have yet to hear of any other game problems in DX 9 except yours.
notherdude u have an old hand. Having an old hand doesnt make sence. Cuz its old. get a new one.. seems like ur hand doesnt understand what it is writing. So placve it in ur rig instead of vista human orgnoids will amke more sense
Reply to notherdude
Ignorance isn't bliss and I have no agenda. If you haven't heard or seen the volumes of reported problems with Vista x64 and DX9 games (pre and post SP1), then you don't get out much.
When something is worth praising, I praise it. When it has problems I report them.
There is much tiresome about anything posted on the internet, especially at Tom's where for bizarre reason "camps" form and in most cases people will not see the reality of the good and bad because they've just become the "proud" owners of product XYZ.
If you want to dispose of these problems with SP1 as trivial, then do so. But I'm reporting my real world experience with Vista x64. And because you haven't heard, doesn't mean the problems don't exist. If you elect to not believe or listen, then that is entirely your prerogative.
Well, if there are significant post SP 1 DX 9 issues I'd be happy to look them over. Show me where they are.
You could have a point. I'm just telling you I have yet to hear about any widespread breaking of DX-9 games due to SP-1. The fact that you so badly exaggerated the known SP 1 issues created by a few apps makes me doubt your judgment on this stuff.
You referred to the problems reported with SP1. I have seen those problems discussed at length, They resulted from a very limited number of apps which had yet to issue fixes - those fixes have now been issued, with the possible exception of two obscure apps, which are sure to issue fixes soon. This is why some people tested SP 1 early, to weed this stuff out. Problem solved, as expected.
This is NOT a big problem.
Don't forget, in the age of the blogosphere this stuff gets instantly reported and blown all out of proportion as every blogger and his brother tries to get a few hits.
Furthermore, until SP 1 is released you cannot say it is or is not problematic. The problem exists sure, for a tiny fraction of a tiny group who GOT IT EARLY. But it is still the final version you say, YES! but the problem is with the apps not the SP. The apps are fixed or getting fixed.
Message edited by notherdude on 02-28-2008 at 01:58:03 AM
notherdude u have an old hand. Having an old hand doesnt make sence. Cuz its old. get a new one.. seems like ur hand doesnt understand what it is writing. So placve it in ur rig instead of vista human orgnoids will amke more sense
Reply to notherdude
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