Last message on previous page:

Yeah--like that board, for example! (c my sig)

Seriously, this article was extremely well-written and beyond useful. It was objective and the author really has the real-world experience with current generation video cards and legacy video cards alike. This is the type of objective article that makes me continue reading at toms.

I will be brutally honest: with the recent Vista SuperFetch article, Tom was really disappointing me. It was, IMHO, the most unprofessional and biased article that had basically already been written before the author actually worked with it. I came very close to giving a "last chance" comment in the notes, but just neglected to click the submit button when my comments were finished.

I have nothing against the author or THG--but the Vista article was just so unprofessional. Keep articles like this AGP one rolling, though, and I'll keep your site on top in my favorites list

Oh, and that bit comparing AGP 8x, AGP 4x, and PCIe x16 was just awesome--I've been wanting to know that stuff for a while, and apparently AGP 4x slots in and of themselves are not bottlenecks (although 4x usually means the mobo/chipset is too old to support the faster FSB/bus speed/HyperTransport layer speed/etc.)

Np that was quite helpful. Maybe if this chip is the cause of some peoples problems that don't have power issues then I am leaning even more towards trying an aftermarket heatsink/fan. I have a KuFormula Plus 1 sitting around that I just got finished lapping. IF it fits and I get an extra ram sink on that VRM area then maybe my occasional problem will disappear.

Thanks

in my experience, system lockups during gaming can frequently be attributed to overheating video cards. If you have no software to monitor the GPU temp, might be a good idea to try and find one.

I apologize if you already covered that as a possibility, but I am posting this in a hurry in an attempt to suggest something helpful.

btw, this is pretty much the most respectful and calm discussion response to an article I have seen in a while. GJ cleeve covering the bases well, and thanks everyone for respecting eachother and not aggressively arguing.

how do you ensure connectors running off separate rails? i have an emermax liberty 400w with dual 12v rails with 20a each and combined 360w on those 2 rails at 30a. i have a "lock-up" issue that requires a hard reset whenever i play valve's source games (hl2, hl2: ep1, cs:s, dod:s). older valve games (original hl and cs) are fine and so are other more stressful games like company of heroes and also cod2 and bf2. i have a 6800gt agp that requires 18a on 12v rail so i should have plenty of juice, but want to make sure video card is on it's own 12v just in case. i have it running off it's own power connector with nothing else on it and it's modular, but not sure if it's on it's own rail or not.

separate question - if this isn't a power issue, it's either an agp issue (via 4-in-1 driver?) or a video card issue (nvidia driver?). would my power supply handle an x1950pro agp? if so, do you think that might clear up my lock-ups in source games?

my full system specs are in my sig.

If you have two rails, I'd imagine one of them is accessed through the 6-pin PCIe video card connector, and the other one is supplying the rest of the system...

So if you're not using the 6-pin PCIe video card connector, one of your 12v rails is probably being unused. This is a pure guess on my part mind you... so if anyone knows for sure, please pipe up.

fyi, my video card just requires one normal 4-pin connector.

I am saying for socket 939 owners with AGP (only) buying an AGP card is NOT economically sensible if the budget is ~$200.

Just a quick search on newegg:
7600GT AGP $180
7600GT PCIe $120 + Socket 939 nforce4 MB with x16 PCIe $57 = $177

You now have a spare motherboard to sell and can upgrade again to other PCIe cards.

The comparison gets even better when you See that there are 7900GS PCIe cards for $175 (or even $150 after rebate I see which fits the ~$200 budget nicely) which are much much faster than the 7900GS AGP cards.....

And as I have mentioned earlier, this is right NOW. In 2 months there will be $130-$200 8600 series cards (that you may never see as AGP) with ~ 7950GT performance.....

I know it is frustrating for AGP users to have to pay a higher price for the same card.

Are AGP cards more expensive to make..or is it a supply and demand and we are getting ripped off>?

:?:

I think you meant 7800 yes? and I would agree with your assessment except if you have a high-end mobo (read asus/gigabyte/dfi with bells and whistles) on agp and a budget pci-e capable mobo would be a step down. (might need gigabit 'net if you have it etc...)

Another thing is that 939 is really not the path to upgrades anyway for the future... and if you keep that high-end agp mobo and go w/ a 1950pro (199 w/ rebate) you can build a new system in a year or so.

Of course, for a low-end agp mobo you make a good point. Naturally I would think you really mean to get a 1950pro in pci-e on that option as it is down at $155 on newegg w/ rebate and beats the 7900gs...

Hardware newbie here, I have a Northwood 2.6C O/C to 3.1 (w/ 1Gb of ram), would that setup be bottlenecking the 1950PRO? Not sure how my system compares to either the Athlon 2500 or the 3400. Currently, I'm running a 6800LE (unfortunately, can't unlock the extra pipes), still trying to decide wether to go for a AGP card upgrade and wait another year on a completely new computer or bite the bullet and build for DX10 now. My LCD is a 20" widescreen LCD, so the max resolution I"ll be running will be around 1600x1080. Mostly upgrading to play games like Ghost Recon advance war fighter, and driving games like WTCC Race and GTR2. thanks,

I second the update for a Dual core test with AGP cards, even tho there aren't many games that take advantage of the second core. Quake 4 only one I can think, but Value did say Source will become Multicore aware this year.


Like most of u i'm also running a S939 AGP rig.

But the price is a big thing for me at the moment. If the price of the 1950pro AGP is too high i'm better off just grabbing a PCI E board and going with the 1950XT 256mb card, which isn't too much more in price.

I liked this article, having a P4 myself. I would like to upgrade to something a lot better, but money's an issue, and I can't buy a QX6700 with school money. I do plan to add another 2 gigs of ram and two more hard drives to my system, and then save my money. I figure by the time I get the money to buy a QX6700, Asus Striker 680i, and the works (somewhere around August 2008), they'll have something out that will perform a lot better.

Right on the money again Cleeve. Might just wanna check out the top chart of prey. It reads as follows:

Max Detail, 4xAA, 8xAF, 1280x1024
Max Detail, 4xAA, 8xAF, 1280x1024
Medium textures, 2xAA, 1024x768

Top 2 are both the same though different results are on the chart.

Thought someone else would have seen this by now. isn't it supposed to be 1600x1200?

Good article and it's come just at the right time for me.

I have an Athlon XP3200, a GIG of PC3200 RAM and an 850XT/PE, I should get £110 for my GPU, a new 1950pro will only cost me about £40 / £50 net so to me thats worth it.

I was just about to upgrade to C2D, I figured if I was moving platforms I might as well go the whole hogg with DDR2, was just about to order the entry level E6300, a DS3 and 2 GIG of Geil PC6400, I had £250 put aside for this (plus the £200 I would have got got for my old bits on ebay), anyway things have changed so it's not an option right now.

It's horses for courses, we all have to work out what suits US best, I know I'm just putting off the enevitable, but I will see a gain with an 1950pro

#1-supply/demand-there is a strong push for the new GPU's and to move away from AGP

#2-usually, they take a PCI-e native chip and create the AGP card with a PCI-e to AGP bridge to basically revert it back to be used on AGP platform. Look at some of the cards that have both models in PCI-e and AGP...they have the gpu located toward the rear of the card, where as most native AGP cards have the gpu located in the center of the card. This isn't ALWAYS the case, but has been common in many cases.

Good catch, Dade. I'll look into that...