LOOK AT ME LOOK LOOK LOOK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

<A HREF="http://www.emulators.com/pentium4.htm" target="_new">http://www.emulators.com/pentium4.htm</A>

GO HERE HERE HERE

I got that opinion and facts from my other post about the pentium 4 7th generation thing here

LOOOK AT IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


-- They have found a way to harness the power of a thunderstorm and expell it with great force!--<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by Fredi on 03/29/01 06:16 AM.</EM></FONT></P>

And the cut-paste too. You're in the top 10 for the 'Wasted bandwidth' award.

The article is a little old, but it pointed out the majority of reasons why I went with T-bird. Good reading for people wondering what the difference is between the processors. Good call!

Man, there's so much hate and animosity in this forum lately. No one can have an opinion around here without getting flammed by some know it all.

-MP Jesse

"Signatures Suck"

On the main page of the site it says:

"Welcome to Emulators Inc., makers of the SOFTMAC 2000 and FUSION PC Apple Macintosh emulators for Microsoft Windows and MS-DOS - the fastest Apple Macintosh emulators available for your PC. We are also the developers of the XFORMER and GEMULATOR Atari emulators for MS-DOS and Windows."

So, FUGGER, their bread and butter is Mac to PC emulators. It is astounding how you pick and choose "facts" to try and make you seem right. Either you're an idiot for not understanding what that company does, or are in denial about your opinions being wrong and have to "fabricate fugger facts" to make you seem right.

The very beginning of his article says that what Intel did in releasing the Willamette is what makes the P4 suck, because Intel did cut things out of the P4 in order to make it cheap enough to be able to sell and even try to compete with Athlon. How you cannot understand this is so baffling. The original P4 core is much more than what the Willamette has in it. It's those things that were removed which makes the P4 a "huge leap backwards."

You are a very sad and angry individual. Did your mommy not love you enough as a child or something? You need to calm down and use that brain I am sure you have, and quit lying in nearly every post you make and try to actually contribute something useful for a change.

"We put the <i>fun</i> back into fundamentalist dogma!"

Ksoth, in typical lemming fashion. read what AMDmeltdown said. He summed it up pretty good.

Bread and butter from emulators, AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH OMFG that was funny.

There is more than just mac emulators, you better go check again.

Here let me quote from that article. just a small example of what were dealing with. and what your "defending"

Ok, so read it and tell me WTF does this have to do with benchmarks, P4 or the price of tea in china. GG Einstien

"Benchmarks Round 2: March 3 2001

Sorry for the bit of a delay. It's been quite the strange week. After wrapping up exhibiting at the Macworld Tokyo computer show last weekend, I woke up in my hotel room on Sunday morning to the rocking motion of a small earthquake. A very minor one as the locals didn't seem concerned at all afterwards, but 30 floors up it caused objects in my hotel room to start swaying quite a bit. We've had minor earthquakes like that in Seattle the past few years which similarly caused no damaged but were enough of an argument to get the city council to overrule the voters (who voted against a new stadium) and build a new $520 million baseball dome stadium using the excuse that the existing Kingdome wasn't earthquake proof. I use the term "dome" loosely, as what was built, Safeco Field, is a sad excuse of an open air stadium with a sheet metal sliding roof. Certainly no Toronto SkyDome.

After returning from Japan and hoping to enjoy the Mardi Gras festivities in Seattle on Tuesday night, I found out the downtown of the city was being trashed in WTO fashion. Due to the public outcry following the 1999 WTO riots, where police were accused of brutality (if there is such a thing as being brutal to public pest), police just stood by on Tuesday night and watched as people were beaten and shot. As the local news channels carried live footage at 11pm of people firing guns in the middle of the streets, young women being kicked and beaten by gangs of young men, police simply stood by and watched and took no action. Not until 2am, 3 hours after the horrific footage was aired live on TV did police step in and break up the rioting. Not until 70 people had been sent to the hospital, one person shot, and one person beaten to death. You probably didn't hear of that no Wednesday, since the killing and rioting was overshadowed by the earthquake. You can read more about the riot on local Seattle news pages such as this one:

http://www.king5.com/detailtopstory.html?StoryID=14894

Why I'm bringing this up is to show just how corrupt the media is and how twisted what you watch on TV is. Not even 9 hours after the Seattle riot, the city was jolted with an earthquake. Not a killer California quake, but still the strongest one to hit Seattle in 50 years and the strongest quake I've ever felt. I was at my desk catching up on email, ironically the same thing I was doing during 2 of the last 3 quakes in the late 90's, when my wall of computer monitors started waving up and down. I knew it wasn't a bad one as there was only the briefest of power interruption as 60 amps of backup battery power kicked in to keep our computers running. Before you could say "do it again, do it again", the local news media was all over it, with live broadcasts of the "massive" earthquake. Within minutes, CNN.COM, MSNBC.COM, FOXNEWS.COM and other "news" sites declared this a "monster" quake, "the Big One", that Seattle was in ruins, and all sorts of other nonsense that was untrue. It was NOT the "Big One" by any stretch of the imagination. The quake neither measured 7.0 as FOX News had declared (it was a 6.2 to 6.8), nor was it a shallow quake, the kind that levels cities. The west cost of Washington state, where Seattle is, gets deep slow rolling earthquakes. It feels more like a roller coaster or fast elevator ride, but in my house nothing fell over. No pictures, no computers, no monitors, no bookshelves. And I live barely 2 minutes from that downtown section shown on the news. Within 30 minutes of the quake I was having lunch at a nearby restaurant. I stopped at a grocery store to pick up some snacks. There was no panic, there was no rush on bottled water. Most of us experienced similar smaller quakes in the past few years.

It was somewhat funny watching the news coverage on Wednesday, both the local news and the national FOX and CNN news, as the same footage of the same handful of buildings was shown over and over again. The Fenix Underground, one of the best known dance clubs in the city and right in the heart of downtown, had its awning collapse due to falling bricks. A few cars similarly got crushed. But it was the same half dozen or so cars that were shown over and over again. There was no widespread leveling of buildings and destruction of cars as the news media portrayed. Yet the news media, hungry for a sensational ratings grabber, hyped the whole earthquake totally out of proportion.

Yes, people got hurt by, in one case, a falling chimney. People fell off motorcycles while riding. Some homes were destroyed by landslides. But guess what? Seattle is a disaster zone every winter! Every year at this time we get some winter storm coming through blowing 60 mile per hour winds or dumping a foot of rain on the area that causes the exact same landslides, building collapses, and trees falling on cars. Remember, this is the same city that is so ill prepared for snow that it closes down schools if there is even a trace of snow on the ground.

It was quite laughable then to see NBC News (remember, they're in bed with Microsoft on the MSNBC thing) send Tom Brokaw down to Seattle to do a live on-site broadcast of the NBC News on Thursday. It was disgusting to see him standing in front of Starbuck's headquarters telling the story of the devastating damage in Seattle. Totally blown out of proportion. When an earthquake kills dozens in California and causes buildings to collapse on people, when hurricanes and tornadoes leave thousands homeless, yes, that's truly a tragedy worthy of national attention. When a few cars get destroyed, that's not, especially when rioting gangs were doing the same thing only 9 hours earlier. ABC and CBS, who have no ties to Microsoft that I know of, wisely chose not to blow this thing out of proportion and did not send Dan Rather or Peter Jennings to cover this media created disaster.

It's amazing to see that the riots from Tuesday night have taken a back seat to this hyped up earthquake media event. The fact that people are being beaten and killed, young women attacked and kicked on the ground on live television as police simply watch and stand by, that is not newsworthy because it's just "yet another Seattle riot". Yet a few bricks fall off the roof of Starbucks headquarters - that's newsworthy to demand the attention of Tom Brokaw. How twisted is this world getting?

And now, poor old governor of Washington, Gary Locke. Five years ago the man helped ram an illegal $520 million dome stadium down taxpayers' throats, a stadium that voters rejected in a democratic election only to have the election overturned by the Microsoft billionaire owners of the Seattle Mariners. Poor old governor Locke is now using the earthquake as an excuse to beg for federal assistance. After blowing $520 million on one dome stadium, then caving it Microsoft billionaire Paul Allen, owner of the Seattle Seahawks football team, he then committed another $400 to Paul Allen to blow up the existing Kingdome stadium in order to build a virtually identical stadium IN THE SAME PLACE. I'm sorry, Seattle is not that big a city. Half a million people. One dome stadium is enough. But to blow up a stadium that had 75 years of life left in it and cave in to Microsoft billionaires' demands to build TWO more dome stadiums right next to each other, that's just ludicrous. Now that the state is out of money, we use the excuse of a landslides and injuries to declare a federal emergency.

What's even more laughable is that the dome stadiums, the Starbucks headquarters, the Fenix Underground and other earthquake damaged buildings are all within a few hundred meters of each other. When entire city blocks were leveled to make room for the second dome stadium, when hundreds of businesses were forcefully relocated, THAT was called progress. Yet when similar buildings across the street (such as, oh, Starbucks) suffer some superficial damage and a few cars gets wrecked, that's considered a federal emergency.

It surprises me Tom Brokaw, who I thought was a respected journalist, would choose to stand outside of a corporate icon such as Starbucks, and not, say, a few miles away at one of Seattle's two airports, where there was true damage. The control tower at Sea-Tac was disabled, the runway at Boeing field cracked open, flights are delayed and the main airport operating at half capacity. That actually affects my travel plans and the plans of thousands of others. That's REAL damage. But that's less important than the Starbucks main lobby?

This is just too screwed up! This entire city, the politicians, and the news media are just out to lunch. My work, and certainly the work of everyone else in the city, would have been less disrupted if the news media simply went away and focused on real news stories. I have wasted hours this week responding to "Oh my God, I heard Seattle got leveled" emails. Thanks for the concern, but please ignore the over-hyped sensationalized news you see on TV."


Lemmings like you make this too easy.

Ok, bigguy did you read what I posted/quoted? I guess that makes sense to you. WTF did that have to do with benchmark?

Maybe this might be more reasonable or realistic. This is as much BS as anyone can bare to read

"The new test systems

So, armed with the same $10000 budget I used to buy two Pentium 4 machines back in November, I set out to put together one each of a 1.0 GHz Pentium III Xeon system and a 1.2 GHz DDR Athlon system. The top of line of each processor line.

As these parts were still not in easy supply locally here in Seattle by January, I mail ordered both systems. For the Pentium III Xeon system I went to Dell (yes, Dell). Despite their idiotic Intel-only policy, I still regard them as the best PC manufacturer and ordered a dual 1.0 GHz Pentium III Xeon system with 512 megabytes of PC800 RDRAM. This weighed in at just around $6000 even. A pricey system, but keep in mind this included an extra $999 for the second processor and would have totalled $5000 for a single processor system.

For the Athlon system, I went to XI Computer in California and had them build a 1.2 GHz Athlon system with 512 megabytes of PC2100 DDR memory. For some reason, DDR memory is no longer referred to as PC266, it's called PC2100. Go figure. This system weighed in fully loaded at under $2800!

To keep things fair with the original Pentium 4 systems, all systems included 60 gig hard disks, internal 250 meg ZIP drives, CD-ROM and/or DVD-ROM drives, USB, etc. I kept the specs of the new systems as close as possible to the 1.5 GHz Pentium 4 systems originally tested, sticking with 512 megabytes of memory in each, sticking with the ZIP drives, and even putting the same costly PC800 RDRAM in the Xeon system instead of opting for the cheaper PC600 RDRAM.

With the money left over I upgraded the original 900 MHz AMD Athlon machine used in December's tests to a new ASUS A7M266 motherboard and DDR memory. Everything else was kept the same (the 900 MHz Thunderbird processor, the hard disk, the DVD drive, the video card, the network card, etc).

So, three new systems to tackle the Pentium 4 and to answer the question: can you do better than blowing $4300 on a 1.5 GHz Pentium 4 system?

By the way, I want to mention that none of the new systems was over clocked. In general I avoided over clocking so as to show the true capabilities of the stock machines, not to see how much liquid nitrogen I could use to speed up a system. Over-clocking is an entirely different topic.

Also, the choice of using 512 megabytes of memory in each system may sound like overkill, but was done for two reasons: to keep the playing field fair between the different systems, and to give Windows ample memory to run everything in physical RAM and avoid swapping. We are testing CPU speed here, not hard disk speed, so random timing variations due to swap file activity needs to be minimized. A typical Windows Millennium or Windows 2000 home system only requires 64 to 128 megabytes but will end up swapping to disk a lot more."

Ok, Like I believe this gimp spent 10K on 2 machines. even at the end of last year pricing. 10k can buy you 5 kick ass machines.

A) he is a liar
B) clueless where to get computers
c) Lemming trying to flame

But bigguy, this makes sense to you huh?

Wow, you can cut and paste a lot, but what is your point?

Where is the fault in his explaination of cycle time and instruction execution? He explained perfectly why the P4 requires 70% more cycles (higher mhz) to get the same job done as a P3 or Athlon.

The source code samples are present in the article. How can you dismiss them, unless you know nothing about programming at the assembler level. I assume you don't.

True to your character, anything you don't agree with (or understand) you classify as BS.

Fugger, I don't have to discredit you. You do a fine job all by yourself.

Sad sad man you are Fugger. Ok, you posted that message to show it had nothing to do with benchmarks, but YOU FAIL TO POST THE REST OF THE TEXT!! ARE YOU RETARDED?! There's a whole nother 5 pages or something!!! The text you posted is just the author telling his OPINION about something on HIS website! It doesn't have anything to do with benchmarks, but it has to do with why his next article was late! You keep astounding me, Fugger.

"We put the <i>fun</i> back into fundamentalist dogma!"

"Ksoth, in typical lemming fashion. read what AMDmeltdown said. He summed it up pretty good.

Bread and butter from emulators, AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH OMFG that was funny.

There is more than just mac emulators, you better go check again."

You, and AMDMeltdown don't think. AMDMeltdown said "he's use to writing 8 bit code and is just mad that he's got to change his programming," or something to that effect. Now, he's been programming on Athlon and Pentium III systems!!! Argh!!!! All those processors are the same x86 based systems!! Why would he have to change his code going from Pentium III to Pentium 4??? IT IS ALL THE SAME, IDIOT! ANYTHING HE WRITES FOR PENTIUM III WILL WORK ON PENTIUM 4! I damn well know there are more than Mac emulators! Atleast I said that In my post to you! But your post said he only does Atary emulators. You are the one in the wrong here, buddy! It keeps astounding me how idiotic you actually are and how your throught process is so flawed that you truly make no sense. It is amazing that someone like you actually has the ability to press buttons that actually form words!

"We put the <i>fun</i> back into fundamentalist dogma!"

Just compair specs youll see what im talking about.

SPUD

<font color=blue>Just some advice from your friendly neighborhood blue man </font color=blue>

Paper specs? According to paper, the P4 is the fastest chip around. But not in the real world.

I still don't see your point. Perhaps you can explain.

Reality check here Spud.

Editorial on this running flame war:

This is better than "Days of our Lives". I have an Intel box and an AMD box in my house and they have yet to try and kill each other... in fact they hum along quite nicely. Hopefully each of you have done research to determine which chip maker is best for you, judging by all the smoke on this and other threads I'd say those opinions have turned into obsessions for some of you. Relax, the CPU in your PC will not determine the fate of the world... unless of course you've lost all touch with reality in which case please step away from the monitor and go for a walk OUTSIDE.


Troubles a-brewing and I'm left holding the spoon.

Multi stage cache design is very similar but Intel decided on a smaller size, two FPU @ 2x clock speed, SMP, extension registers (VIS and MMX), ECC.

Now as far as I am concerned the P4 is going to need it’s cache size increased to be a real contender, because you have to admit once smaller (0.13u) and slight modifications (larger cache, low latency memory) are done the P4 will be untouchable, it has unbelievable potential. It’s unfortunate that Intel may have been spooked by AMD's speed superiority and released the P4 too early. But they will make up for it because I remember way back when the original K-6 was much faster and stronger than the original Pentiums. Intel came back with a vengeance. I believe that history is making a repeat performance. Intel will rebound and prevail as they have done in the past. Give them credit they survived 85, and held off the Japanese from consuming our technology market, give them time they will return to make you eat your works just as they have done in the past.

SPUD


<font color=blue>Just some advice from your friendly neighborhood blue man </font color=blue>

Sure there are some things good about the Pentium 4. The article doesn't say that. The article does point out what about the Pentium 4 design makes it a weaker chip. You are incorrect about the FPU. The Pentium 4 only has 1 FPU, but it has 2 ALU (arithmetic logic units) that are running at 2x clock speed. Again, it's not the good things that the author calls mistakes. It's the mistakes that the author points out that make the Pentium 4 an inherintly weaker processor compared to Athlon and Pentium III.

The fact about the Pentium 4 is this: Intel intentionally crippled the Willamette because they needed to make the die size smaller or else it would have been too expensive to even sell. When Intel moves to .13 micron fab and 300 mm wafers, the Northwood Pentium 4 will be equipped with what it was initially designed with, and then will most likely be a very good chip. The author of the article says this. The Willamette is what sucks.

It boggles my mind why this fact is not accepted by those who have hard-ons for Intel. Atleast you are man enough (if that's the right phrase to use ) to admit that the Pentium 4 now is crippled, while Fugger and AmdMeltdown are so stubborn about their wrong position in the matter.

"We put the <i>fun</i> back into fundamentalist dogma!"