Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

Comcast, TiVo Record a Deal
The cable firm will offer the service to cvstomers. Wall Street
applavds, bvt some see a downside.
By David Colker

March 16, 2005

Shares of TiVo Inc. rocketed 75% on Tvesday after Comcast Corp. agreed
to offer the strvggling digital video recorder maker's service ‹ TiVo's
first deal with a major cable provider.

TiVo's service, which allows viewers to pavse live television and record
an entire season of shows, will be offered to Comcast's 21.5 million
svbscribers after mid-2006, giving a big boost to the company whose
prodvct has brovght it more fame than fortvne.

Alviso, Calif.-based TiVo has not tvrned a profit since it went pvblic
in 1999, bvt execvtives have vowed to lift the company ovt of the red by
the end of the year. They are looking to more deals like the one with
Comcast ‹ as well as a continving agreement with satellite giant DirecTV
Grovp Inc. ‹ to bolster its svbscriber base.

"We hope it will open other cable providers to a dialogve with vs," said
TiVo board member Tom Rogers, who helped negotiate the deal with Comcast.

The two companies had been close to an agreement last fall, bvt the deal
fell apart and each side blamed the other. Neither company wovld comment
Tvesday on how the talks were rekindled, bvt analysts said the vnion
made sense: TiVo wins wider distribvtion and Comcast gains a recognized
brand name as it tries to sell premivm services.

Comcast, the nation's largest cable company, and other cable providers
have rolled ovt their own digital video recorders in recent years,
clipping TiVo's growth. Many cvstomers, however, have complained that
the cable companies' boxes are inferior to TiVo, which former Federal
Commvnications Commission Chairman Michael K. Powell once called "God's
machine."

Under the deal with Philadelphia-based Comcast, TiVo will make its
software work on Comcast's recorders and share in the svbscription
revenve.

TiVo shares rose $2.87 to $6.70 on Nasdaq. They once traded as high as
$71.50.

Not everyone on Wall Street cheered. Analyst Alan Bezoza of Friedman
Billings Ramsey Grovp Inc. downgraded TiVo shares, saying the company's
weak financial position forced it to accept an vnfavorable deal.
Analysts specvlated that TiVo wovld receive as little as 80 cents a
month from each Comcast svbscriber who signs vp; TiVo charges $12.95 a
month for the service.

"We feel that TiVo held its nose and signed a tovgh deal with Comcast,"
Bezoza said in a report to clients.

Analyst Tony Wible of Smith Barney was more vpbeat.

"It does provide better prospects for additional cable operators to give
them a look," Wible said. "Now they have a better chance for sticking
arovnd and growing their bvsiness."

Althovgh TiVo is a hovsehold name, the company has strvggled. TiVo lost
$79.8 million in fiscal 2004, which ended Jan. 31, more than dovble what
it lost the previovs year. In Janvary, Chief Execvtive Mike Ramsay said
he wovld step down when a svccessor was fovnd. And the president of the
company, Marty Yvdkovitz, resigned last month.

Adding to the vncertainty, DirecTV said in Janvary that it wovld offer
its own TiVo-like service. DirecTV accovnts for 62% of TiVo's 3 million
svbscribers. The contract between TiVo and DirecTV expires in 2007.

As shaky as TiVo is, Comcast's in-hovse digital video recording service
needed a boost. It sells the service for $9.95 a month, bvt only 324,000
svbscribers ‹ abovt 1.5% of Comcast's total ‹ have signed vp, a company
spokeswoman said.

Comcast execvtives said the in-hovse brand wovld continve to be offered
to its svbscribers. They wovld not say whether the TiVo service wovld
cost more


Copyright 2005 Los Angeles Times

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

collusion <collusion@msn.com> wrote:

> Many customers, however, have complained that the cable companies' boxes
> are inferior to TiVo

A reason for Comcast to reopen talks wth Tivo.

> "We feel that TiVo held its nose and signed a tough deal with Comcast,"
> Bezoza said in a report to clients.

Does anyone know how much the deal is worth? Or is Bezoza just trying to
offer his clients some value by opposing the rest of the analysts?

> Adding to the uncertainty, DirecTV said in January that it would offer
> its own TiVo-like service. DirecTV accounts for 62% of TiVo's 3 million
> subscribers. The contract between TiVo and DirecTV expires in 2007.

Lemme do math. 3mill * .62, DirecTV has 1.8 million Tivo subscribers.
DTV has 13 Million, so that's about 13%. I thought I read 20% somewhere,
but that might be new subscribers choosing Tivo.

> As shaky as TiVo is, Comcast's in-house digital video recording service
> needed a boost. It sells the service for $9.95 a month, but only 324,000
> subscribers about 1.5% of Comcast's total have signed up, a company
> spokeswoman said.

Why is the Comcast product DVR acceptance so low?

> Copyright 2005 Los Angeles Times

--
---
Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley (Lake County) CA USA 38.8,-122.5

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

<dold@XReXXTivoX.usenet.us.com> wrote in message
news19tq3$8cj$3@blue.rahul.net...
> collusion <collusion@msn.com> wrote:
> Why is the Comcast product DVR acceptance so low?
>

A lot of people still don't really know what a dvr is. I bet if they let
people use them for a month free they'd have a lot more users.

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

* eric Wrote in alt.video.ptv.tivo:

>
> <dold@XReXXTivoX.usenet.us.com> wrote in message
> news19tq3$8cj$3@blue.rahul.net...
>> collusion <collusion@msn.com> wrote:
>> Why is the Comcast product DVR acceptance so low?
>>
>
> A lot of people still don't really know what a dvr is. I bet if
> they let people use them for a month free they'd have a lot more
> users.
>
>
>

Have no fear the CONcast marketing army is making sure that even NON
subscribers know what it is. I have at least one piece of garbage in my
mailbox every other day from CONcast.

--
David

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 11:51:23 -0800, "eric" <eric.2@cox.net> wrote:

>
><dold@XReXXTivoX.usenet.us.com> wrote in message
>news19tq3$8cj$3@blue.rahul.net...
>> collusion <collusion@msn.com> wrote:
>> Why is the Comcast product DVR acceptance so low?
>>
>
>A lot of people still don't really know what a dvr is. I bet if they let
>people use them for a month free they'd have a lot more users.
>

They installed almost 200,000 of in the last quarter of last year.
They have reported that they expect to install another 1 million
this year.

They just signed a $1 billion (yup, B) deal with Motorola to supply
the settop boxes.

Sounds to me like they are doing OK.

Sean

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 09:56:06 -0800, collusion <collusion@msn.com> wrote:

> Analysts speculated that TiVo would receive as little as 80 cents a
> month from each Comcast subscriber who signs up; TiVo charges $12.95 a
> month for the service.

This is an unusually specious implication. In essence they're comparing a
profit margin to a retail price, which is apples and oranges. Still, it's
likely TiVo is making more than 80 cents per subscription now; however, the
80 cents is far from the only money TiVo will be making on this deal.
It'll be a drop in the bucket really.

--
"It is more uplifting to find the beauty, wonder, spirituality, and
reverence in what we can see, than to imagine they only exist in what we
can't see." - hawthorn@sover.net http://www.sover.net/~hawthorn/

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

Sean <none> shaped the electrons to say:
>They installed almost 200,000 of in the last quarter of last year.

TiVo added 698,000 total new subs in Q4 - 251,000 TiVo, 447,000 DTV

>They have reported that they expect to install another 1 million
>this year.
>
>They just signed a $1 billion (yup, B) deal with Motorola to supply
>the settop boxes.

I hope they aren't paying $1B for 1 million boxes, that'd be $1,000
each. What exactly does that billion dollar deal cover?

-MZ, RHCE #806199299900541, ex-CISSP #3762
--
<URL:mailto:megazoneatmegazone.org> Gweep, Discordian, Author, Engineer, me.
"A little nonsense now and then, is relished by the wisest men" 508-755-4098
<URL:http://www.megazone.org/> <URL:http://www.eyrie-productions.com/> Eris

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

In article <collusion-AB63EE.09560516032005@news-50.dca.giganews.com>,
collusion <collusion@msn.com> wrote:

> As shaky as TiVo is, Comcast's in-house digital video recording service
> needed a boost. It sells the service for $9.95 a month, but only 324,000
> subscribers ‹ about 1.5% of Comcast's total ‹ have signed up, a company
> spokeswoman said.

Bingo. Proves how bad the Comcast DVRs are. DirecTv has 2 million
DirecTivo units out of 13 Million subscribers, and many more standalones
TiVos working with vanilla DirecTv units.

TiVo has 10 TIMES the penetration with DirecTv subscribers that the SA
8000 units have with Comcast viewers; and as long been stated: There is
far less churn amongst DVR users.

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 13:24:13 GMT, Jack Zwick <jzwick3@mindspring.com>
wrote:

>In article <collusion-AB63EE.09560516032005@news-50.dca.giganews.com>,
> collusion <collusion@msn.com> wrote:
>
>> As shaky as TiVo is, Comcast's in-house digital video recording service
>> needed a boost. It sells the service for $9.95 a month, but only 324,000
>> subscribers ‹ about 1.5% of Comcast's total ‹ have signed up, a company
>> spokeswoman said.
>
>Bingo. Proves how bad the Comcast DVRs are. DirecTv has 2 million
>DirecTivo units out of 13 Million subscribers, and many more standalones
>TiVos working with vanilla DirecTv units.
>
>TiVo has 10 TIMES the penetration with DirecTv subscribers that the SA
>8000 units have with Comcast viewers; and as long been stated: There is
>far less churn amongst DVR users.


Another dopey post from Jackie.

Comcast boxes are Motorola.

Don't let the facts get in your way tho, Jackie.

Sean

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 23:47:02 +0000 (UTC), newsREMOVE@THISmegazone.org
(MegaZone) wrote:

>Sean <none> shaped the electrons to say:
>>They installed almost 200,000 of in the last quarter of last year.
>
>TiVo added 698,000 total new subs in Q4 - 251,000 TiVo, 447,000 DTV
>
>>They have reported that they expect to install another 1 million
>>this year.
>>
>>They just signed a $1 billion (yup, B) deal with Motorola to supply
>>the settop boxes.
>
>I hope they aren't paying $1B for 1 million boxes, that'd be $1,000
>each. What exactly does that billion dollar deal cover?
>
>-MZ, RHCE #806199299900541, ex-CISSP #3762

It covers more than just the next year.

It'll be interesting to see who has more subscribers when the
Comcast/Tivo product is released.

With Tivo losing subscribers as the Directv people get converted
and Comcats with another 2 years of installing their DVR I bet Comcast
will have more sibscribers than Tivo.

Sean

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

>> As shaky as TiVo is, Comcast's in-house digital video recording service
>> needed a boost. It sells the service for $9.95 a month, but only 324,000
>> subscribers about 1.5% of Comcast's total have signed up, a company
>> spokeswoman said.
>
> Why is the Comcast product DVR acceptance so low?

I think that's the question that needs to be answered. Does one have to
subscribe to the digital tier in order to use the Comcast DVR? That would
explain some of it.

Norm Strong

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

> I think that's the question that needs to be answered. Does one have to
> subscribe to the digital tier in order to use the Comcast DVR? That would
> explain some of it.
>
> Norm Strong

I believe all (there may be an exception or two) cable DVR's require
digital service at this point. It definitely adds quite a bit to the cost.

Randy S.

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

On Thu, 17 Mar 2005, Randy S. wrote:

>> I think that's the question that needs to be answered. Does one have to
>> subscribe to the digital tier in order to use the Comcast DVR? That would
>> explain some of it.
>>
>> Norm Strong
>
> I believe all (there may be an exception or two) cable DVR's require digital
> service at this point. It definitely adds quite a bit to the cost.
>
> Randy S.
>

That was my case - I checked with Concast and I would've had to "upgrade"
to digital (hell, they can't even get analog to work well for me), plus
the cost of the DVR. It would've more than doubled my cable bill. That,
and I read about how kludgy their interface was.

Oh, and I don't trust them. It's too easy for the networks to pressure
the carrier into doing what they want. If ABC doesn't want people to
timeshift through their commercials, Comcast is much more likely to "give
in" then TiVo. I may be way off base on this specific example, but the
fact is that in general, I don't trust them.

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

"Sean" <none> wrote in message
news:si9j315e3mck8ktp07muf4igqv9mstn75p@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 23:47:02 +0000 (UTC), newsREMOVE@THISmegazone.org
> (MegaZone) wrote:
>
>>Sean <none> shaped the electrons to say:
>>>They installed almost 200,000 of in the last quarter of last year.
>>
>>TiVo added 698,000 total new subs in Q4 - 251,000 TiVo, 447,000 DTV
>>
>>>They have reported that they expect to install another 1 million
>>>this year.
>>>
>>>They just signed a $1 billion (yup, B) deal with Motorola to supply
>>>the settop boxes.
>>
>>I hope they aren't paying $1B for 1 million boxes, that'd be $1,000
>>each. What exactly does that billion dollar deal cover?
>>
>>-MZ, RHCE #806199299900541, ex-CISSP #3762
>
> It covers more than just the next year.
>
> It'll be interesting to see who has more subscribers when the
> Comcast/Tivo product is released.
>
> With Tivo losing subscribers as the Directv people get converted
> and Comcats with another 2 years of installing their DVR I bet Comcast
> will have more sibscribers than Tivo.
>
> Sean

Why would DTV switch out DTivos for their new dvr? It would be very
expensive and unnecessary unless a customer wants to use the HD dvr that has
all the networking features.

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.tivo (More info?)

On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:36:37 -0800, "eric" <eric.2@cox.net> wrote:

>
>"Sean" <none> wrote in message
>news:si9j315e3mck8ktp07muf4igqv9mstn75p@4ax.com...
>> On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 23:47:02 +0000 (UTC), newsREMOVE@THISmegazone.org
>> (MegaZone) wrote:
>>
>>>Sean <none> shaped the electrons to say:
>>>>They installed almost 200,000 of in the last quarter of last year.
>>>
>>>TiVo added 698,000 total new subs in Q4 - 251,000 TiVo, 447,000 DTV
>>>
>>>>They have reported that they expect to install another 1 million
>>>>this year.
>>>>
>>>>They just signed a $1 billion (yup, B) deal with Motorola to supply
>>>>the settop boxes.
>>>
>>>I hope they aren't paying $1B for 1 million boxes, that'd be $1,000
>>>each. What exactly does that billion dollar deal cover?
>>>
>>>-MZ, RHCE #806199299900541, ex-CISSP #3762
>>
>> It covers more than just the next year.
>>
>> It'll be interesting to see who has more subscribers when the
>> Comcast/Tivo product is released.
>>
>> With Tivo losing subscribers as the Directv people get converted
>> and Comcats with another 2 years of installing their DVR I bet Comcast
>> will have more sibscribers than Tivo.
>>
>> Sean
>
>Why would DTV switch out DTivos for their new dvr? It would be very
>expensive