Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

I estimate my digital content to be growing at about 100GB/yr. Blame it
on a growing collection of RAW, MP3, MPEG-2, and AVI files. As well as a
desire to host my own website.

I want to de-couple the storage and backup of this increasingly
priceless library from the PCs where's it currently stored (currently a
deskside and a laptop, on a home LAN).

I'm looking for suggestions/strategies for designing a home multimedia
storage solution that will be comfortably scalable over the next 10+
years. Specifically, I'd like to be able to:

1. Add a SATA or IDE "big" drive (200+G) or 2 a year.
2. Implement automated back up of all the content to a redundant drive
subsystem. I would like to avoid backing up the content to DVDs if I
can, in part because I have vague concerns about the compatibility over
time of DVD+/-Rs and the reliability/compatibility over time of DVD+/-RWs.

I currently generate most of my content using a 6MP DSLR and a MiniDV
camcorder. I anticipate moving to a 12+MP DSLR and a HDV camcorder
within a couple of years, greatly increasing the growth rate of my
storage needs.

I currently use only WinXP/NTFS but I can envision adding a Mac to the
LAN at some point, and I'm not opposed to rolling my own, say, Linux
server (although I'm concerned about the increased maintainance efforts
of a mixed-mode environment)

Any suggestions? What are *your* strategies?

Bill

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Bill wrote:
> I estimate my digital content to be growing at about 100GB/yr. Blame it
> on a growing collection of RAW, MP3, MPEG-2, and AVI files. As well as a
> desire to host my own website.
>
> I want to de-couple the storage and backup of this increasingly
> priceless library from the PCs where's it currently stored (currently a
> deskside and a laptop, on a home LAN).
>
> I'm looking for suggestions/strategies for designing a home multimedia
> storage solution that will be comfortably scalable over the next 10+
> years. Specifically, I'd like to be able to:
>
> 1. Add a SATA or IDE "big" drive (200+G) or 2 a year.
> 2. Implement automated back up of all the content to a redundant drive
> subsystem. I would like to avoid backing up the content to DVDs if I
> can, in part because I have vague concerns about the compatibility over
> time of DVD+/-Rs and the reliability/compatibility over time of DVD+/-RWs.
>
> I currently generate most of my content using a 6MP DSLR and a MiniDV
> camcorder. I anticipate moving to a 12+MP DSLR and a HDV camcorder
> within a couple of years, greatly increasing the growth rate of my
> storage needs.
>
> I currently use only WinXP/NTFS but I can envision adding a Mac to the
> LAN at some point, and I'm not opposed to rolling my own, say, Linux
> server (although I'm concerned about the increased maintainance efforts
> of a mixed-mode environment)
>
> Any suggestions? What are *your* strategies?

The mixed-mode problems go away if you use Linux for every box on the
LAN. I just upgraded my wife from Windows "me" to Fedora, and my
trouble-ticket load has gone to near zero. :-)

While it's nice to have everything online, rotating magnetic storage
is not a long-term archive medium. There are high-capacity magnetic
tape solutions, but they are expensive and subject to the same
obsolescence problems as everything else.

My strategy is to archive to optical media and plan to copy the oldest
archive disks to current technology every year or so. My collection
is small enough that I'm just now considering a move from CD-R to
writable DVD's. If you intend to maintain your collection in digital
form, you really have no choice but to plan on continuous copying of
your oldest archive media, and on the periodic migration to new storage
technologies as they become available.

I have a cousin who's committing all of his images to archival paper
for long-term storage. I think he's missing the point of digital
photography, but he will definitely not need to worry about the
reliability of DVD storage.

Paul Allen

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Sun, 17 Jul 2005 04:36:17 -0700, Bill <billmuy@comcast.net> wrote:

>I estimate my digital content to be growing at about 100GB/yr. Blame it
>on a growing collection of RAW, MP3, MPEG-2, and AVI files. As well as a
> desire to host my own website.
>
>I want to de-couple the storage and backup of this increasingly
>priceless library from the PCs where's it currently stored (currently a
>deskside and a laptop, on a home LAN).
--->snip<-----
>Any suggestions? What are *your* strategies?
>
>Bill

I follow the NASA "triple redundancy" scheme.

I have a raid array in my computer (set up for redundency/fault
tolerance). (Online Storage)

I have an external 200GB HDD that gets plugged in long enough to back
up the files, then gets unplugged and goes back on a shelf. (Nearline
Storage)

And every time I have enough data to fill a DVD, that data also gets
burned to a DVD, labeled, and placed in a holder in a controlled
environment. (Offline Storage/Archive).

Eventually I'm sure I'll fill the HDD and I'll have to get another.
Also eventually some other form of optical disk (blu-ray?) will come
along and I'll have to re-burn all of that stuff too.
Drifter
"I've been here, I've been there..."

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Sun, 17 Jul 2005 04:36:17 -0700, Bill <billmuy@comcast.net> wrote:

>I estimate my digital content to be growing at about 100GB/yr. Blame it
>on a growing collection of RAW, MP3, MPEG-2, and AVI files. As well as a
> desire to host my own website.
>
>I want to de-couple the storage and backup of this increasingly
>priceless library from the PCs where's it currently stored (currently a
>deskside and a laptop, on a home LAN).
>
>I'm looking for suggestions/strategies for designing a home multimedia
>storage solution that will be comfortably scalable over the next 10+
>years. Specifically, I'd like to be able to:
>
>1. Add a SATA or IDE "big" drive (200+G) or 2 a year.
>2. Implement automated back up of all the content to a redundant drive
>subsystem. I would like to avoid backing up the content to DVDs if I
>can, in part because I have vague concerns about the compatibility over
>time of DVD+/-Rs and the reliability/compatibility over time of DVD+/-RWs.
>
>I currently generate most of my content using a 6MP DSLR and a MiniDV
>camcorder. I anticipate moving to a 12+MP DSLR and a HDV camcorder
>within a couple of years, greatly increasing the growth rate of my
>storage needs.
>
>I currently use only WinXP/NTFS but I can envision adding a Mac to the
>LAN at some point, and I'm not opposed to rolling my own, say, Linux
>server (although I'm concerned about the increased maintainance efforts
>of a mixed-mode environment)
>
>Any suggestions? What are *your* strategies?
>
>Bill

I installed a disc drawer to the machine, and bought several drawer inserts.
Each insert holds a drive, and I have a few set up, one for DV and one for
stills, one for system, one for NET etc etc...

I do my normal backup to CDR and DVDR and every now and then I plug in the
appropriate HD and copy over to that. Takes care of what to do with an old
drive!

Drawers only cost $20 so it's a cheap solution.

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Bob wrote:
> On Sun, 17 Jul 2005 04:36:17 -0700, Bill <billmuy@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
>>I estimate my digital content to be growing at about 100GB/yr. Blame it
>>on a growing collection of RAW, MP3, MPEG-2, and AVI files. As well as a
>> desire to host my own website.
>>
>>I want to de-couple the storage and backup of this increasingly
>>priceless library from the PCs where's it currently stored (currently a
>>deskside and a laptop, on a home LAN).
>>
>>I'm looking for suggestions/strategies for designing a home multimedia
>>storage solution that will be comfortably scalable over the next 10+
>>years. Specifically, I'd like to be able to:
>>
>>1. Add a SATA or IDE "big" drive (200+G) or 2 a year.
>>2. Implement automated back up of all the content to a redundant drive
>>subsystem. I would like to avoid backing up the content to DVDs if I
>>can, in part because I have vague concerns about the compatibility over
>>time of DVD+/-Rs and the reliability/compatibility over time of DVD+/-RWs.
>>
>>I currently generate most of my content using a 6MP DSLR and a MiniDV
>>camcorder. I anticipate moving to a 12+MP DSLR and a HDV camcorder
>>within a couple of years, greatly increasing the growth rate of my
>>storage needs.
>>
>>I currently use only WinXP/NTFS but I can envision adding a Mac to the
>>LAN at some point, and I'm not opposed to rolling my own, say, Linux
>>server (although I'm concerned about the increased maintainance efforts
>>of a mixed-mode environment)
>>
>>Any suggestions? What are *your* strategies?
>>
>>Bill
>
>
> I installed a disc drawer to the machine, and bought several drawer inserts.
> Each insert holds a drive, and I have a few set up, one for DV and one for
> stills, one for system, one for NET etc etc...
>
> I do my normal backup to CDR and DVDR and every now and then I plug in the
> appropriate HD and copy over to that. Takes care of what to do with an old
> drive!
>
> Drawers only cost $20 so it's a cheap solution.
>


You got drawers for yours? Wow! I just plug the cables into one while
it sits on the desk as I fill it, wrap it back up in the pretty plastic
and box, and store it offsite. I grabbed up a crate of 24 Maxtor 160Gb
SATA drives at a auction last year for a song. I've used two so far.

--
jer
email reply - I am not a 'ten'

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Sun, 17 Jul 2005 21:10:07 -0500, Jer <gdunn@airmail.ten> wrote:

>>
>>
>> I installed a disc drawer to the machine, and bought several drawer inserts.
>> Each insert holds a drive, and I have a few set up, one for DV and one for
>> stills, one for system, one for NET etc etc...
>>
>> I do my normal backup to CDR and DVDR and every now and then I plug in the
>> appropriate HD and copy over to that. Takes care of what to do with an old
>> drive!
>>
>> Drawers only cost $20 so it's a cheap solution.
>>
>
>
>You got drawers for yours? Wow! I just plug the cables into one while
>it sits on the desk as I fill it, wrap it back up in the pretty plastic
>and box, and store it offsite. I grabbed up a crate of 24 Maxtor 160Gb
>SATA drives at a auction last year for a song. I've used two so far.

Lucky!

I need to upgrade this machine, it won't take a 160...

I use the drawers because I can't get at the machine in the desk... it's easy to
just plug it in and out, no wireing...

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

The best method I've found so far is keeping multiple (at least 2)
backups on large external hard drives in ADS DualLink USB/1394
enclosures
http://shopper.cnet.com/Dual_Link_ [...] 0&sort=asc

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

BobFlintstone@spam.com> wrote:
> On Sun, 17 Jul 2005 21:10:07 -0500, Jer <gdunn@airmail.ten> wrote:
>
>
>>>
>>>I installed a disc drawer to the machine, and bought several drawer inserts.
>>>Each insert holds a drive, and I have a few set up, one for DV and one for
>>>stills, one for system, one for NET etc etc...
>>>
>>>I do my normal backup to CDR and DVDR and every now and then I plug in the
>>>appropriate HD and copy over to that. Takes care of what to do with an old
>>>drive!
>>>
>>>Drawers only cost $20 so it's a cheap solution.
>>>
>>
>>
>>You got drawers for yours? Wow! I just plug the cables into one while
>>it sits on the desk as I fill it, wrap it back up in the pretty plastic
>>and box, and store it offsite. I grabbed up a crate of 24 Maxtor 160Gb
>>SATA drives at a auction last year for a song. I've used two so far.
>
>
> Lucky!
>
> I need to upgrade this machine, it won't take a 160...
>
> I use the drawers because I can't get at the machine in the desk... it's easy to
> just plug it in and out, no wireing...
>


I don't consider myself lucky, albeit, there are rare moments of fortune
that seem to serve that purpose. I like your idea of the drawers in
that it makes the chore less painful, thereby making it more possible
that it be done. And that's really the important part - getting it
done. Despite the importance, if it's painful to accomplish, it's less
likely to be done successfully. You and I choose magnetic, some choose
optical, some choose nothing. A rocket scientist will know which choice
proves fatal.

The system here was upgraded specifically because of my fortune, an
Intel motherboard that does both ATA and SATA, and the memory was
transplanted. The new mb and CPU was cheap and easy enough to get the
job done. And that's the important part.


--
jer
email reply - I am not a 'ten'

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Mon, 18 Jul 2005 22:34:34 -0500, Jer <gdunn@airmail.ten> wrote:

>BobFlintstone@spam.com> wrote:
>> On Sun, 17 Jul 2005 21:10:07 -0500, Jer <gdunn@airmail.ten> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>>
>>>>I installed a disc drawer to the machine, and bought several drawer inserts.
>>>>Each insert holds a drive, and I have a few set up, one for DV and one for
>>>>stills, one for system, one for NET etc etc...
>>>>
>>>>I do my normal backup to CDR and DVDR and every now and then I plug in the
>>>>appropriate HD and copy over to that. Takes care of what to do with an old
>>>>drive!
>>>>
>>>>Drawers only cost $20 so it's a cheap solution.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>You got drawers for yours? Wow! I just plug the cables into one while
>>>it sits on the desk as I fill it, wrap it back up in the pretty plastic
>>>and box, and store it offsite. I grabbed up a crate of 24 Maxtor 160Gb
>>>SATA drives at a auction last year for a song. I've used two so far.
>>
>>
>> Lucky!
>>
>> I need to upgrade this machine, it won't take a 160...
>>
>> I use the drawers because I can't get at the machine in the desk... it's easy to
>> just plug it in and out, no wireing...
>>
>
>
>I don't consider myself lucky, albeit, there are rare moments of fortune
>that seem to serve that purpose. I like your idea of the drawers in
>that it makes the chore less painful, thereby making it more possible
>that it be done. And that's really the important part - getting it
>done. Despite the importance, if it's painful to accomplish, it's less
>likely to be done successfully. You and I choose magnetic, some choose
>optical, some choose nothing. A rocket scientist will know which choice
>proves fatal.

Actually, I backup on everything, CDr, DVDr, and various HDs... I once had a HD
failure and now I'm gunshy! If you ask me for a photo, I can probably produce at
least 7 copies of it! 3 or 4 is the minimum, but the numbers go up when I do a
total backup, but with 240 gigs of HD that's getting harder and rarer!

>The system here was upgraded specifically because of my fortune, an
>Intel motherboard that does both ATA and SATA, and the memory was
>transplanted. The new mb and CPU was cheap and easy enough to get the
>job done. And that's the important part.

I have an Intel board as well, but it don't like 160 drives! Not sure why, it
crashed out the whole system when I tried one, even blanked out other drives...
I could install a Promise board I guess, but then I'd have to get this machine
out of the desk!

And I need an excuse to get a new machine!

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Paul Allen <"paul dot l dot allen at comcast dot net"> writes:

> My strategy is to archive to optical media and plan to copy the
> oldest archive disks to current technology every year or so. My
> collection is small enough that I'm just now considering a move from
> CD-R to writable DVD's. If you intend to maintain your collection
> in digital form, you really have no choice but to plan on continuous
> copying of your oldest archive media, and on the periodic migration
> to new storage technologies as they become available.

Wait a bit till decent archival DVDs come out. MAM and TDK have them
in the pipeline I believe. Also keep in mind that having your originals
and archive reduced to ash/mud/doggie-do does not make your day. (don't
bother to ask how I know...) so have at least all the ones you care about
in another place for safety.

> I have a cousin who's committing all of his images to archival paper
> for long-term storage. I think he's missing the point of digital
> photography, but he will definitely not need to worry about the
> reliability of DVD storage.

Wise man. I suspect in 50 years he will be the one with the memories!
I still shoot BW film for just this reason.

--
Paul Repacholi 1 Crescent Rd.,
+61 (08) 9257-1001 Kalamunda.
West Australia 6076
comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot
Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.
EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.