Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops (More info?)

Hi all,

I'd like to use a PocketPC handheld to
copy images from my digital camera and
view them, and then store them for
later use, freeing up my compactflash.
But to do that I need a handheld that
has a hard drive built-in. Seems
entirely logical and a good idea,
but do any handheld actually have a
hard drive?

Thanks.

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops (More info?)

"ziliath" <ziliath@myway.com> wrote in message
news:6b963d7f.0407011924.2c830b46@posting.google.com
> Hi all,
>
> I'd like to use a PocketPC handheld to
> copy images from my digital camera and
> view them, and then store them for
> later use, freeing up my compactflash.
> But to do that I need a handheld that
> has a hard drive built-in. Seems
> entirely logical and a good idea,
> but do any handheld actually have a
> hard drive?

ziliath,

Yes--handhelds have persistent memory (a hard drive so-to-speak) with varying sizes. For example, a
Palm Tungsten T has 16MB (Megabytes) of built-in memory whereas some Pocket PCs and other Palm OS
devices have more, such as 64MB of built-in memory.

On a more interesting note (given your idea here) many handhelds now support the use of removable
media (or memory cards). Handhelds (depending on the model) can use small, stamp-sized memory cards,
such as SD (Secure Digtal) cards, MMCs (Multimedia Cards), or Compact Flash cards to expand their
built-in memory.

If you haven't already purchased a handheld computer, I would suggest a Palm handheld for a number
of very good reasons. First, Palm OS (Operating System) handhelds are the most well-established,
holding the largest market share. So why is this important? There are many more programs available
for Palm OS handhelds versus PocketPCs.

Second reason I would suggest a Palm OS handheld? It is what is commonly called 'form factor' in the
handheld industry--it is the size and weight of a handheld; however, PocketPCs have really come
along way since they were first brought to market a couple years ago--some of them are much smaller
than previous models. The form factor is important to keep in mind largely because this will
determine if you are likely to carry your handheld wherever you go--if its too bulky, you won't
carry it after a while. The Palm Tungsten models are very nice whereas they are small and light
weight--they have an excellent form factor.

In closing, I would suggest you consider a Palm Tungsten series handheld:

Tungsten T
Tungsten T2
Tungsten T3

I would also consider the following application, Splashphoto. NOTE: There are other photo programs
available; however, Splash Photo comes with desktop software that assists Palm users with
synchronizing their pictures from their desktop to their handheld. Splashphoto also supports
installing pictures to memory cards, such as SD or MMCs--you'll really like this feature. Here's the
link (click on the link or copy and paste into your browser's address bar):

http://www.palmgear.com/index.cfm? [...] odID=13040

Finally, if you have any more questions, simply post a reply or you may send an e-mail.

--
Best regards,

Todd Shillam
Information Technology Consultant
Shillam Technology
http://shillamtechnology.point2this.com

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops (More info?)

Just get more, larger CF cards instead of carrying around a PocketPC.

You can get a couple of 512 MB CF cards cheaper than any PPC..

"ziliath" <ziliath@myway.com> wrote in message
news:6b963d7f.0407011924.2c830b46@posting.google.com...
> Hi all,
>
> I'd like to use a PocketPC handheld to
> copy images from my digital camera and
> view them, and then store them for
> later use, freeing up my compactflash.
> But to do that I need a handheld that
> has a hard drive built-in. Seems
> entirely logical and a good idea,
> but do any handheld actually have a
> hard drive?
>
> Thanks.

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops (More info?)

On 1 Jul 2004 21:01:25 -0700, ziliath@myway.com (ziliath) wrote:

>Hi all,
>
>I'd like to use a PocketPC handheld to
>copy images from my digital camera and
>view them, and then store them for
>later use, freeing up my compactflash.
>But to do that I need a handheld that
>has a hard drive built-in. Seems
>entirely logical and a good idea,
>but do any handheld actually have a
>hard drive?
>
>Thanks.

If you're trying to off-load CF Cards so you can reuse them in your
camera, then you want _large_ quantities of room. You also need a way
to get pictures from a CF Card you've used in your camera to the
alternative. Both present challenges.

I don't think any PDAs have actual hard drives built-in. Most PDAs
support some sort of removable storage (CF, SD, ...). But I don't
think any of these cards have more than 5 GB, and the ones that do are
pricey.

Given that you want to copy from a CF Card to another storage medium,
you need two connections. I think only a few PDAs have a CF Card and
another slot. At least some (but definitely not all) PDAs support USB
"host" (probably not the right term), which might let you connect your
camera and thus copy from the CF Card _in_ your camera to something in
a slot on the PDA.

You might consider a PDA with USB "host" teamed up with a 2.5" hard
drive in an external case with USB connector. You can buy such a case
for < $50 US. I'm not sure about prices for 2.5" IDE drives. Not the
least expensive route, but you would have lots of room.

Another option might be a CD writer, but I think that would require a
laptop. And if you were already carrying a laptop, you probably
wouldn't have asked the question.

If you don't have any other reason to carry a PDA, I think one of the
other alternatives would be more convenient and cost less. Someone
else mentioned devices that are meant to off-load storage cards. I
think some of these connect to televisions, so you can preview and/or
share your pictures. But I think the best solution, in terms of
portability and cost, would be to carry several CF Cards.



-----------------------------------------
To reply to me, remove the underscores (_) from my email address (and please indicate which newsgroup and message).

Robert E. Zaret, eMVP
PenFact, Inc.
500 Harrison Ave., Suite 3R
Boston, MA 02118
www.penfact.com

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops (More info?)

RE/
>I'd like to use a PocketPC handheld to
>copy images from my digital camera and
>view them, and then store them for
>later use, freeing up my compactflash.
>But to do that I need a handheld that
>has a hard drive built-in. Seems
>entirely logical and a good idea,
>but do any handheld actually have a
>hard drive?

Technically "yes", via a CF drive - but the capacities are going to be too low.

If you're willing to go with a dedicated device, you have serveral options that
I know of...maybe more:

1) Something like a DataTank or DigitalWallet which are laptop drives wrapped
something that's specifically designed to D/L the contents of a memory card and
store it.

2) A device that burns directly to CD without needing a PC host and which reads
(and stores?) memory cards. Can't remember any names, but I've seen at least
one.

3) A bottom-of-the-line PC or notebook - maybe even one with a built-in burner.

4) An Apple iPod plus a $100 add-on that enables it to read/store pictures from
memory cards.



If the form factor were acceptable, #3 would appeal to me the most because it
would also give a viewing option.


I've got #1 in the form of a 3-gig DigitalWallet (whose maker, I think, is
defunct).

Recently purchased the card reader/downloader for my 40-gig iPod, but was
disappointed to see that it was slow as Death, only did pictures, needed
separate non-rechargable batteries, and didn't do all that well on battery life.
--
PeteCresswell

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops (More info?)

"Jon C" <news@jonnythan.com> wrote in message news:<shiFc.1529$iJ4.1161@twister.nyroc.rr.com>...

> Just get more, larger CF cards instead of carrying around a PocketPC.
> You can get a couple of 512 MB CF cards cheaper than any PPC..

Just?? Excuse me but the US middle class is in recession
at the moment with no improvement in sight. Why on earth
would anyone "just" run out and spend so much more per
megabyte, unless they are very irresponsible? It would be
much smarter to wait for a PDA to come along that has
a hard drive, or use the new iRiver device that can
download movies from a camera to its hard drive.

But obviously, the key problem is that manufacturers
have not addressed consumers' needs very well. People
want fewer devices that do more---manufacturers want
more devices that do less with only slight improvement
each year---because that maximizes profit. However there
is always some grey wolf company who sees this and
deliberately breaks away from the pack, producing something
useful that sells like hotcakes.

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops (More info?)

"ziliath" <ziliath@myway.com> wrote in message
news:6b963d7f.0407060937.2118b129@posting.google.com...
> "Jon C" <news@jonnythan.com> wrote in message
news:<shiFc.1529$iJ4.1161@twister.nyroc.rr.com>...
>
> > Just get more, larger CF cards instead of carrying around a PocketPC.
> > You can get a couple of 512 MB CF cards cheaper than any PPC..
>
> Just?? Excuse me but the US middle class is in recession
> at the moment with no improvement in sight. Why on earth
> would anyone "just" run out and spend so much more per
> megabyte, unless they are very irresponsible? It would be
> much smarter to wait for a PDA to come along that has
> a hard drive, or use the new iRiver device that can
> download movies from a camera to its hard drive.
>

No offense but you're making alot of assumptions. First, the US economy is
doing quite well, in fact it's doing so well that the Fed recently raised
interest rates in order to curb inflation. They are in fact considering
several interest rate hikes over the next 18 months.

Second, you are making assumptions on the cost-per-megabyte of CF memory
compared to a PDA that has yet to be created. We have no hard evidence that
it would actually be smarter or cheaper to wait for a PDA with a hard drive.
We might wait so long for that to happen that the camera and it's associated
flash memory cards may be obsolete or dirt cheap. By the time the PDA w/hard
drive comes out we may have cameras with hard drives.

With respect to being irresponsible it would appear that the person who
bought a camera without a mechanism to store the vast quantities of pictures
they intend to take may be the irresponsible one.


> But obviously, the key problem is that manufacturers
> have not addressed consumers' needs very well. People
> want fewer devices that do more---manufacturers want
> more devices that do less with only slight improvement
> each year---because that maximizes profit. However there
> is always some grey wolf company who sees this and
> deliberately breaks away from the pack, producing something
> useful that sells like hotcakes.

What may not be so obvious is that there are technical issues preventing the
wide spread useage of small form factor hard drives in PDA devices. First
and foremost they are cost prohibitive for most people who need PDA
functionality for more than just the "wow" factor. Second they are power
hungry devices and current PDAs already have battery life issues. I suspect
that several of the PDA companies have already done a market analysis and
have determined that with current technology there is not a sufficient
market for a PDA w/harddrive to justify the enormous development and support
costs. And of course there are always those nasty stock holders that seem to
be anal-retentive about maximum profits.

TC

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops (More info?)

"Tony Clark" <curiousgeorge1964@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<GtLGc.7209$R36.3686@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net>...

> No offense but you're making alot of assumptions. First, the US economy is
> doing quite well,

Oh I see, you're one of those people who believes whatever
the conservative elites tell you to believe. Well frankly
I don't have any time for dealing with idiots willingly
brainwashed by the corporate media.

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops (More info?)

RE/
> Second they are power
>hungry devices and current PDAs already have battery life issues.

Has anybody heard anything more about the (alcohol-based?) fuel cells that were
being touted some months ago as an improvement over batteries for laptops?
--
PeteCresswell

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops (More info?)

"ziliath" <ziliath@myway.com> wrote in message
news:6b963d7f.0407071304.3b3258cc@posting.google.com...
> "Tony Clark" <curiousgeorge1964@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:<GtLGc.7209$R36.3686@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net>...
>
> > No offense but you're making alot of assumptions. First, the US economy
is
> > doing quite well,
>
> Oh I see, you're one of those people who believes whatever
> the conservative elites tell you to believe. Well frankly
> I don't have any time for dealing with idiots willingly
> brainwashed by the corporate media.

Wow, your overwhelming command of the facts really put me in my place. Why
you're so good at the art of rebuttal that you don't even need to offer up
any factual information to support your position. It's sheer genius the way
you use personal attacks to gain the advantage in public debate. I sure
don't want to tangle with your superior intelligence.....

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops (More info?)

Tony Clark wrote:
> Wow, your overwhelming command of the facts really put me in my place. Why
> you're so good at the art of rebuttal that you don't even need to offer up
> any factual information to support your position. It's sheer genius the way
> you use personal attacks to gain the advantage in public debate. I sure
> don't want to tangle with your superior intelligence.....

Bravo sir, bravo indeed. Note, no sarcasm here.
--
Marc
http://www.marcmywords.com

- If it's Tourist Season, why can't we shoot 'em???

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops (More info?)

I have a Palm OS 5 powered Zodiac 2 by Tapwave.com. It's greate advantage
over many handhelds is that it has 2 SD slots insted of one. You can now
purchase 512MB 60x SD cards & 1 to 4GB have been anounced by several
companys. So if you put in two 1GB SD cards even that would be great for
storage and viewing of photos. The Zodiac also has the best screen on the
market so that's a 2nd advantage.

Regards,
-Skon

"ziliath" <ziliath@myway.com> wrote in message
news:6b963d7f.0407011924.2c830b46@posting.google.com...
> Hi all,
>
> I'd like to use a PocketPC handheld to
> copy images from my digital camera and
> view them, and then store them for
> later use, freeing up my compactflash.
> But to do that I need a handheld that
> has a hard drive built-in. Seems
> entirely logical and a good idea,
> but do any handheld actually have a
> hard drive?
>
> Thanks.

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops (More info?)

ziliath@myway.com (ziliath) wrote in news:6b963d7f.0407011924.2c830b46
@posting.google.com:

> Hi all,
>
> I'd like to use a PocketPC handheld to
> copy images from my digital camera and
> view them, and then store them for
> later use, freeing up my compactflash.
> But to do that I need a handheld that
> has a hard drive built-in. Seems
> entirely logical and a good idea,
> but do any handheld actually have a
> hard drive?

What most people think of as a hard drive, no. They require too much power
and are too fragile. All handhelds have ROM and persistent RAM, though, so
you can save your programs and data. Why do you need a hard drive?

--
Regards,

Stan

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops (More info?)

ziliath@myway.com (ziliath) writes:

> Hi all,
>
> I'd like to use a PocketPC handheld to
> copy images from my digital camera and
> view them, and then store them for
> later use, freeing up my compactflash.
> But to do that I need a handheld that
> has a hard drive built-in. Seems
> entirely logical and a good idea,
> but do any handheld actually have a
> hard drive?
>
> Thanks.

The compactflash are the hard drives of the handheld. You may have
noted that a compactflash memory is nowhere as fast as true computer
memory. It feels as slow as a mere hard disk.

Buy a bigger compactflash.

Or buy a compactflash/USB card reader and read the files on your desktop PC.

The above solutions will work 100%, but perhaps you need to archive
much more images than would fit in a couple of compactflash, and you
don't have and don't want a desktop PC. So, one could imagine the
following solution, but it's not sure it'll work:

- Find an USB interface for your PocketPC (perhaps there's none).
- Buy a USB hard drive.
- Hook them.
- See if you can access the hard disk from your PocketPC (perhaps
there's no driver to do it).

Besides, this solution will be more expensive than buying a mere USB
card reader for an existing desktop PC.

--
__Pascal Bourguignon__ http://www.informatimago.com/

There is no worse tyranny than to force a man to pay for what he does not
want merely because you think it would be good for him. -- Robert Heinlein