Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

I have skills sufficient to make my own PC, but since I have not done this
for a few years, am way behind on the latest technology. I would like ideas
on the best motherboard, processor, RAM, and perhaps hard drive. Case
recommendations are welcome.

My use is mostly office applications (Word, Access, Excel), basic photo
editing, limited video editing, limited gaming (if at all), Quicken, and
plenty of Internet use with a cable modem through Comcast. I'll be using a
Zip drive, Jaz drive, DVD burner, CD burner, and Zio card reader through a
USB port. Plus wireless keyboard and mouse, and Palm Pilot. I have a
Matrox G400 card with digital output for a Samsung 171P LCD, but is there a
better card with digital out for mostly text use? Opinions on Western
Digital 250 gig hard drive (Ultra/DMA 100)?

Thanks,

- Phil

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"Phil" <p.mentz@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:nUsTc.151804$eM2.75083@attbi_s51...
> I have skills sufficient to make my own PC, but since I have not done this
> for a few years, am way behind on the latest technology. I would like
ideas
> on the best motherboard, processor, RAM, and perhaps hard drive. Case
> recommendations are welcome.
>
> My use is mostly office applications (Word, Access, Excel), basic photo
> editing, limited video editing, limited gaming (if at all), Quicken, and
> plenty of Internet use with a cable modem through Comcast. I'll be using
a
> Zip drive, Jaz drive, DVD burner, CD burner, and Zio card reader through a
> USB port. Plus wireless keyboard and mouse, and Palm Pilot. I have a
> Matrox G400 card with digital output for a Samsung 171P LCD, but is there
a
> better card with digital out for mostly text use? Opinions on Western
> Digital 250 gig hard drive (Ultra/DMA 100)?
>
> Thanks,
>
> - Phil

OK, this is a complex post that is hard to respond to without knowing your
budget. First thing though is to ditch the IDE hard drive. As you say
you'll be using four drives, I take it these are IDE drives you already own?
If so, SATA would be the way to go for the hard drive. It won't cost
anymore, and it will leave more space on your IDE ports. I think Matrox may
be the last holdout of the video card makers that do not support 3D well.
Even their latest supposed 3D gaming card oddly doesn't list directx version
(hardware compatibility) in the specifications. The good news is that all
the latest 3D cards offer excellent text quality and DVI output. So if you
want to upgrade your video card to something other than Matrox, it will be
really tough to screw up on that choice. For a mid-range system, I'd
suggest a FX5900XT or Radeon 9800 Pro. Before someone screams "But those
are gaming cards!!!", YES, they are. They also offer excellent text
quality. And shopping for a non-gaming card at the moment would be foolish
unless you have a very specific non-gaming need in mind. Western Digital is
a great brand of hard drive. I've tried other brands but keep coming back
to WD. However, I'd suggest SATA, and 250GB is a great choice for size.
For a decent mid-range system, look for a i865 chipset mainboard with SATA
and IDE support and built-in LAN and IEEE1394 (firewire). Throw a ~3.0GHz
Intel P4 Prescott core processor on it, and about 1GB of DDR400 RAM to start
with. (Optional: 2 X 512MB if your mainboard supports dual channel. I
like Kingston and Mushkin brands myself.) You're going to need a good
mid-tower case with plenty of drive bays and a 400W or better power supply.
The case is so dependent on personal taste, it's almost foolish to try to
guess what you'd like. But for the power supply, try a Seasonic or
Fortron/Sparkle brand. If you want more specific recommendations, I might
try something like the following. -Dave

(from newegg)

COOLER MASTER CENTURION 2 Black ALUMINUM MID-TOWER CASE, Model
"CAC-T02" -RETAIL
Specifications:
Case Type: Mid-Tower Case
Color: Black
Material: Aluminum front bezel + Case 0.8 mm SECC (Zinc-coated steel)
Drive Bays: 5.25" x 4/0, 3.5" x 2/2 (external/internal)
Expansion Slots: 7
Front Ports: 2xUSB2.0, 2xAudio, IEEE 1394
Power Supply: N/A
Cooling System: N/A
Motherboard Compatibility: ATX; 12" x 9.6" (30.5cm x 24.5 cm)
Dimensions: 18.6" x 7.8" x 16.8" (LxWxH) more info-> N82E16811119034
$39.99
$39.99


GIGABYTE "GA-8IPE1000 PRO-G" i865PE Chipset Motherboard for Intel Socket
478 CPU -RETAIL
Specifications:
Supported CPU: Intel Pentium 4 Processors(HT Ready, Prescott Ready)
Chipset: Intel 865PE + ICH5
FSB: 800/533/400MHz
RAM: 4x DIMM for Dual-Channel DDR400/333/266 Max 4GB
IDE : 2x ATA 100 up to 4 Devices
Slots: 1x AGP 8X/4X(1.5V only), 5x PCI
Ports: 2xPS/2,1xLPT,2xCOM,8xUSB2.0(Rear 4),1xLAN,1xGAME,Audio Ports
Onboard Audio: Realtek ALC850 8-Channel Codec
Onboard LAN: Marvell 8001 Gigabit Ethernet
Onboard SATA: 2x SATA 150
Onboard 1394: TI TSB43AB23, 2 Ports
Form Factor: ATX more info-> N82E16813128231
$92.00
$92.00


Seasonic 400W ATX12V Power Supply, Model "SUPER TORNADO-400W" -RETAIL
Specifications:
Type: ATX12V
Maximum Power: 400W
PFC: Active
Efficiency: Up to 80%
Input Voltage: 100-240V
Input Frequency Range: 60/50Hz
Input Current: 5A
Output: +3.3V@28A, +5V@30A, +12V@22A, -12V@0.8A, +5VSB@2A
Approvals: UL, CB, CE, DEMCO, NEMCO, SEMCO, FIMCO, CCC, TUV, FCC more info->
N82E16817151018
$86.00
$86.00


DIY Blowout Sale!
Intel Pentium 4/ 3.0E GHz 800MHz FSB, 1MB L2 Cache, Hyper Threading
Technology - Retail
Specifications:
Model: Intel Pentium 4 w/ Hyper Threading
Core: Prescott
Operating Frequency: 3.0GHz
FSB: 800MHz
Cache: L1/12K+16K; L2/1MB
Voltage: 1.25V - 1.525V
Process: 0.09Micron
Socket: Socket 478
Multimedia Instruction: MMX, SSE, SSE2, SSE3
Warranty: 3-year MFG
Packaging: Retail box (with Heatsink and Fan) more info-> N82E16819116171
$213.00
$213.00


Western Digital 250GB 7200RPM SATA Hard Drive, Model WD2500JD, OEM Drive
Only
Specifications:
Capacity: 250GB
Average Seek Time: 8.9 ms
Buffer: 8MB
Rotational Speed: 7200 RPM
Interface: Serial ATA
Features: Data Lifeguard Tools, Backplane compatibility
Manufacturer Warranty: 3 years
Packaging: OEM Drive Only more info-> N82E16822144154
$171.00
$171.00








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Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Dave,

Thank you! The budget is pretty open. The components recommended come to
$601.99 and that is fine, but I need to that a new video card, which is
still OK. The IDE drives I do still own, but if it makes sense, I can drop
the Zip and Jaz, and just the CD burner and/or DVD burner. I found a 250
gig drive from WD for $140 with a $30 rebate, but it says Ultra DMA/100, so
it appears this is not the WD 250 you recommend (SATA).

- Phil

"Dave C." <mdupre@sff.net> wrote in message
news:2o7e4iF7oe7jU1@uni-berlin.de...
>
> "Phil" <p.mentz@comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:nUsTc.151804$eM2.75083@attbi_s51...
> > I have skills sufficient to make my own PC, but since I have not done
this
> > for a few years, am way behind on the latest technology. I would like
> ideas
> > on the best motherboard, processor, RAM, and perhaps hard drive. Case
> > recommendations are welcome.
> >
> > My use is mostly office applications (Word, Access, Excel), basic photo
> > editing, limited video editing, limited gaming (if at all), Quicken, and
> > plenty of Internet use with a cable modem through Comcast. I'll be
using
> a
> > Zip drive, Jaz drive, DVD burner, CD burner, and Zio card reader through
a
> > USB port. Plus wireless keyboard and mouse, and Palm Pilot. I have a
> > Matrox G400 card with digital output for a Samsung 171P LCD, but is
there
> a
> > better card with digital out for mostly text use? Opinions on Western
> > Digital 250 gig hard drive (Ultra/DMA 100)?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > - Phil
>
> OK, this is a complex post that is hard to respond to without knowing your
> budget. First thing though is to ditch the IDE hard drive. As you say
> you'll be using four drives, I take it these are IDE drives you already
own?
> If so, SATA would be the way to go for the hard drive. It won't cost
> anymore, and it will leave more space on your IDE ports. I think Matrox
may
> be the last holdout of the video card makers that do not support 3D well.
> Even their latest supposed 3D gaming card oddly doesn't list directx
version
> (hardware compatibility) in the specifications. The good news is that all
> the latest 3D cards offer excellent text quality and DVI output. So if
you
> want to upgrade your video card to something other than Matrox, it will be
> really tough to screw up on that choice. For a mid-range system, I'd
> suggest a FX5900XT or Radeon 9800 Pro. Before someone screams "But those
> are gaming cards!!!", YES, they are. They also offer excellent text
> quality. And shopping for a non-gaming card at the moment would be
foolish
> unless you have a very specific non-gaming need in mind. Western Digital
is
> a great brand of hard drive. I've tried other brands but keep coming back
> to WD. However, I'd suggest SATA, and 250GB is a great choice for size.
> For a decent mid-range system, look for a i865 chipset mainboard with SATA
> and IDE support and built-in LAN and IEEE1394 (firewire). Throw a ~3.0GHz
> Intel P4 Prescott core processor on it, and about 1GB of DDR400 RAM to
start
> with. (Optional: 2 X 512MB if your mainboard supports dual channel. I
> like Kingston and Mushkin brands myself.) You're going to need a good
> mid-tower case with plenty of drive bays and a 400W or better power
supply.
> The case is so dependent on personal taste, it's almost foolish to try to
> guess what you'd like. But for the power supply, try a Seasonic or
> Fortron/Sparkle brand. If you want more specific recommendations, I might
> try something like the following. -Dave
>
> (from newegg)
>
> COOLER MASTER CENTURION 2 Black ALUMINUM MID-TOWER CASE, Model
> "CAC-T02" -RETAIL
> Specifications:
> Case Type: Mid-Tower Case
> Color: Black
> Material: Aluminum front bezel + Case 0.8 mm SECC (Zinc-coated steel)
> Drive Bays: 5.25" x 4/0, 3.5" x 2/2 (external/internal)
> Expansion Slots: 7
> Front Ports: 2xUSB2.0, 2xAudio, IEEE 1394
> Power Supply: N/A
> Cooling System: N/A
> Motherboard Compatibility: ATX; 12" x 9.6" (30.5cm x 24.5 cm)
> Dimensions: 18.6" x 7.8" x 16.8" (LxWxH) more info-> N82E16811119034
> $39.99
> $39.99
>
>
> GIGABYTE "GA-8IPE1000 PRO-G" i865PE Chipset Motherboard for Intel Socket
> 478 CPU -RETAIL
> Specifications:
> Supported CPU: Intel Pentium 4 Processors(HT Ready, Prescott Ready)
> Chipset: Intel 865PE + ICH5
> FSB: 800/533/400MHz
> RAM: 4x DIMM for Dual-Channel DDR400/333/266 Max 4GB
> IDE : 2x ATA 100 up to 4 Devices
> Slots: 1x AGP 8X/4X(1.5V only), 5x PCI
> Ports: 2xPS/2,1xLPT,2xCOM,8xUSB2.0(Rear 4),1xLAN,1xGAME,Audio Ports
> Onboard Audio: Realtek ALC850 8-Channel Codec
> Onboard LAN: Marvell 8001 Gigabit Ethernet
> Onboard SATA: 2x SATA 150
> Onboard 1394: TI TSB43AB23, 2 Ports
> Form Factor: ATX more info-> N82E16813128231
> $92.00
> $92.00
>
>
> Seasonic 400W ATX12V Power Supply, Model "SUPER TORNADO-400W" -RETAIL
> Specifications:
> Type: ATX12V
> Maximum Power: 400W
> PFC: Active
> Efficiency: Up to 80%
> Input Voltage: 100-240V
> Input Frequency Range: 60/50Hz
> Input Current: 5A
> Output: +3.3V@28A, +5V@30A, +12V@22A, -12V@0.8A, +5VSB@2A
> Approvals: UL, CB, CE, DEMCO, NEMCO, SEMCO, FIMCO, CCC, TUV, FCC more
info->
> N82E16817151018
> $86.00
> $86.00
>
>
> DIY Blowout Sale!
> Intel Pentium 4/ 3.0E GHz 800MHz FSB, 1MB L2 Cache, Hyper Threading
> Technology - Retail
> Specifications:
> Model: Intel Pentium 4 w/ Hyper Threading
> Core: Prescott
> Operating Frequency: 3.0GHz
> FSB: 800MHz
> Cache: L1/12K+16K; L2/1MB
> Voltage: 1.25V - 1.525V
> Process: 0.09Micron
> Socket: Socket 478
> Multimedia Instruction: MMX, SSE, SSE2, SSE3
> Warranty: 3-year MFG
> Packaging: Retail box (with Heatsink and Fan) more info-> N82E16819116171
> $213.00
> $213.00
>
>
> Western Digital 250GB 7200RPM SATA Hard Drive, Model WD2500JD, OEM Drive
> Only
> Specifications:
> Capacity: 250GB
> Average Seek Time: 8.9 ms
> Buffer: 8MB
> Rotational Speed: 7200 RPM
> Interface: Serial ATA
> Features: Data Lifeguard Tools, Backplane compatibility
> Manufacturer Warranty: 3 years
> Packaging: OEM Drive Only more info-> N82E16822144154
> $171.00
> $171.00
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"Dave C." wrote:

> "Phil" <p.mentz@comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:nUsTc.151804$eM2.75083@attbi_s51...
> > I have skills sufficient to make my own PC, but since I have not done this
> > for a few years, am way behind on the latest technology. I would like
> ideas
> > on the best motherboard, processor, RAM, and perhaps hard drive. Case
> > recommendations are welcome.
> >
> > My use is mostly office applications (Word, Access, Excel), basic photo
> > editing, limited video editing, limited gaming (if at all), Quicken, and
> > plenty of Internet use with a cable modem through Comcast. I'll be using
> a
> > Zip drive, Jaz drive, DVD burner, CD burner, and Zio card reader through a
> > USB port. Plus wireless keyboard and mouse, and Palm Pilot. I have a
> > Matrox G400 card with digital output for a Samsung 171P LCD, but is there
> a
> > better card with digital out for mostly text use? Opinions on Western
> > Digital 250 gig hard drive (Ultra/DMA 100)?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > - Phil
>
> OK, this is a complex post that is hard to respond to without knowing your
> budget. First thing though is to ditch the IDE hard drive. As you say
> you'll be using four drives, I take it these are IDE drives you already own?
> If so, SATA would be the way to go for the hard drive. It won't cost
> anymore, and it will leave more space on your IDE ports. I think Matrox may
> be the last holdout of the video card makers that do not support 3D well.
> Even their latest supposed 3D gaming card oddly doesn't list directx version
> (hardware compatibility) in the specifications. The good news is that all
> the latest 3D cards offer excellent text quality and DVI output. So if you
> want to upgrade your video card to something other than Matrox, it will be
> really tough to screw up on that choice. For a mid-range system, I'd
> suggest a FX5900XT or Radeon 9800 Pro. Before someone screams "But those
> are gaming cards!!!", YES, they are. They also offer excellent text
> quality. And shopping for a non-gaming card at the moment would be foolish
> unless you have a very specific non-gaming need in mind. Western Digital is
> a great brand of hard drive. I've tried other brands but keep coming back
> to WD. However, I'd suggest SATA, and 250GB is a great choice for size.
> For a decent mid-range system, look for a i865 chipset mainboard with SATA
> and IDE support and built-in LAN and IEEE1394 (firewire). Throw a ~3.0GHz
> Intel P4 Prescott

Why Intel? Why not an Athlon 64?

> core processor on it, and about 1GB of DDR400 RAM to start
> with. (Optional: 2 X 512MB if your mainboard supports dual channel. I
> like Kingston and Mushkin brands myself.) You're going to need a good
> mid-tower case with plenty of drive bays and a 400W or better power supply.
> The case is so dependent on personal taste, it's almost foolish to try to
> guess what you'd like. But for the power supply, try a Seasonic or
> Fortron/Sparkle brand. If you want more specific recommendations, I might
> try something like the following. -Dave
>
> (from newegg)
>
> COOLER MASTER CENTURION 2 Black ALUMINUM MID-TOWER CASE, Model
> "CAC-T02" -RETAIL
> Specifications:
> Case Type: Mid-Tower Case
> Color: Black
> Material: Aluminum front bezel + Case 0.8 mm SECC (Zinc-coated steel)
> Drive Bays: 5.25" x 4/0, 3.5" x 2/2 (external/internal)
> Expansion Slots: 7
> Front Ports: 2xUSB2.0, 2xAudio, IEEE 1394
> Power Supply: N/A
> Cooling System: N/A
> Motherboard Compatibility: ATX; 12" x 9.6" (30.5cm x 24.5 cm)
> Dimensions: 18.6" x 7.8" x 16.8" (LxWxH) more info-> N82E16811119034
> $39.99
> $39.99
>
> GIGABYTE "GA-8IPE1000 PRO-G" i865PE Chipset Motherboard for Intel Socket
> 478 CPU -RETAIL
> Specifications:
> Supported CPU: Intel Pentium 4 Processors(HT Ready, Prescott Ready)
> Chipset: Intel 865PE + ICH5
> FSB: 800/533/400MHz
> RAM: 4x DIMM for Dual-Channel DDR400/333/266 Max 4GB
> IDE : 2x ATA 100 up to 4 Devices
> Slots: 1x AGP 8X/4X(1.5V only), 5x PCI
> Ports: 2xPS/2,1xLPT,2xCOM,8xUSB2.0(Rear 4),1xLAN,1xGAME,Audio Ports
> Onboard Audio: Realtek ALC850 8-Channel Codec
> Onboard LAN: Marvell 8001 Gigabit Ethernet
> Onboard SATA: 2x SATA 150
> Onboard 1394: TI TSB43AB23, 2 Ports
> Form Factor: ATX more info-> N82E16813128231
> $92.00
> $92.00
>
> Seasonic 400W ATX12V Power Supply, Model "SUPER TORNADO-400W" -RETAIL
> Specifications:
> Type: ATX12V
> Maximum Power: 400W
> PFC: Active
> Efficiency: Up to 80%
> Input Voltage: 100-240V
> Input Frequency Range: 60/50Hz
> Input Current: 5A
> Output: +3.3V@28A, +5V@30A, +12V@22A, -12V@0.8A, +5VSB@2A
> Approvals: UL, CB, CE, DEMCO, NEMCO, SEMCO, FIMCO, CCC, TUV, FCC more info->
> N82E16817151018
> $86.00
> $86.00
>
> DIY Blowout Sale!
> Intel Pentium 4/ 3.0E GHz 800MHz FSB, 1MB L2 Cache, Hyper Threading
> Technology - Retail
> Specifications:
> Model: Intel Pentium 4 w/ Hyper Threading
> Core: Prescott
> Operating Frequency: 3.0GHz
> FSB: 800MHz
> Cache: L1/12K+16K; L2/1MB
> Voltage: 1.25V - 1.525V
> Process: 0.09Micron
> Socket: Socket 478
> Multimedia Instruction: MMX, SSE, SSE2, SSE3
> Warranty: 3-year MFG
> Packaging: Retail box (with Heatsink and Fan) more info-> N82E16819116171
> $213.00
> $213.00

For around the same price, one could get an Athlon 64 3200+.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipse [...] i=2065&p=1

>
>
> Western Digital 250GB 7200RPM SATA Hard Drive, Model WD2500JD, OEM Drive
> Only
> Specifications:
> Capacity: 250GB
> Average Seek Time: 8.9 ms
> Buffer: 8MB
> Rotational Speed: 7200 RPM
> Interface: Serial ATA
> Features: Data Lifeguard Tools, Backplane compatibility
> Manufacturer Warranty: 3 years
> Packaging: OEM Drive Only more info-> N82E16822144154
> $171.00
> $171.00
>
> [Image]
>
> [Image]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

> Why Intel? Why not an Athlon 64?
>

Video Editing. For about the thousandth time, there is nothing wrong with
an Athlon 64, but it is not significantly better than a Intel P4 Prescott.
AMD is always a good choice, but not always the best choice. And video
editing applications are specifically optimized for Intel processors. And
yes, I see you posted your link showing one or two benchmarks in which the
AMD beats the Intel. On average though, the low-end Athlon 64 processors
are evenly matched with the mid-range Intel P4 Prescott processors. Please
stop bashing Intel. You are doing nobody any favors by doing so. -Dave

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"Phil" <p.mentz@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:1vyTc.292211$JR4.264253@attbi_s54...
> Dave,
>
> Thank you! The budget is pretty open. The components recommended come to
> $601.99 and that is fine, but I need to that a new video card, which is
> still OK. The IDE drives I do still own, but if it makes sense, I can
drop
> the Zip and Jaz, and just the CD burner and/or DVD burner. I found a 250
> gig drive from WD for $140 with a $30 rebate, but it says Ultra DMA/100,
so
> it appears this is not the WD 250 you recommend (SATA).
>
> - Phil


Well at that price, it would almost be worth it to stick with IDE for the
hard drive. But most motherboards will only support up to (4) total IDE
devices. The zip and jaz drives are IDE, aren't they? (I honestly don't
know, never used one). If you think you will have a use for them, don't get
rid of them. It makes sense for you to go with a SATA hard drive for a
couple of reasons. First, that will leave your four IDE spots open for your
other drives, which will work out GREAT. Second, the SATA drive might be
easier to recycle into the next system you build.

BUT, if you decide to go with an IDE hard drive, I'd suggest you drop the CD
burner. It would be nice to still have it in the system, but the DVD burner
will burn CDs, also. OR, you could get an expansion card to add more IDE
drives and stick the jaz and zip drives both on that. That would leave
three IDE devices and the mainboard supports up to four. -Dave

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"Dave C." wrote:

> > Why Intel? Why not an Athlon 64?
> >
>
> Video Editing. For about the thousandth time, there is nothing wrong with
> an Athlon 64, but it is not significantly better than a Intel P4 Prescott.

An Athlon 64 is much better tham a comparably priced P4 for business
applications and for many games, as well as many other types of applications.
The 32 bit processor you mentioned doesn't run 64 bit software. An Athlon 64
is much better than a comparably priced 64 bit Pentium 4 chip for running 64 bit
software.

http://www.anandtech.com/linux/showdoc.aspx?i=2163&p=1

>
> AMD is always a good choice, but not always the best choice. And video
> editing applications are specifically optimized for Intel processors.

Did you see this?

http://www.anandtech.com/linux/showdoc.aspx?i=2163&p=4

> And
> yes, I see you posted your link showing one or two benchmarks in which the
> AMD beats the Intel.

One or two? You mean there were only a very small number of benchmarks
where a comparably priced P4 beat an Athlon 64.

> On average though, the low-end Athlon 64 processors
> are evenly matched with the mid-range Intel P4 Prescott processors.

Evenly matched? Certainly not for business software.

A 3.2 ghz P4 Prescott is close in price to an Athlon 64 3400+.
The The Athlon 64 3400+ scored 24.9 in Business Winstone 2004,
while the P4 3.2 Prescott scored 21.8. Even a $105 Athlon XP 3000+
beats a $260 P4 3.2 ghz Prescott in Business Winstone 2004.

> Please
> stop bashing Intel.

Why? Am I bashing Intel, or just showing that AMD processors are much
better alternatives for most people? Many might say that Intel processors
are good, but that AMD processors provide so much more value at each
price point.


> You are doing nobody any favors by doing so.

Perhaps if Intel started pricing their processors more comptatively,
then an Intel processor might become a more viable option. Many
knowledgeable people don't want to pay a high price premium when
buying a processor to help cover Intel's huge marketing costs.
There are issues that can be discussed. It is silly of you to say
that AMD processors and comparably priced Intel processors are
evenly matched, especially when the evidence seems to say that
there are tremendous differences, and that for the vast najority
of users, an AMD processor is the more cost effective choice.
I haven't seen Intel's 64 bit P4 processors on www.pricewatch.com yet.
It doesn't make any sense for someone to spend more than $150
for a processor that is only 32 bits. Even at the $150 level, one
should seriously think about the drawbacks of locking themselves into
a 32 bit processor. How many people buy a PC with the intention of using
it for less than a year? A year from now there will probably be plenty of
X86-64 64 bit software available.



> -Dave

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"JK" <JK9821@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:411F789F.47B3C73E@netscape.net...
>
>
> "Dave C." wrote:
>
> > > Why Intel? Why not an Athlon 64?
> > >
> >
> > Video Editing. For about the thousandth time, there is nothing wrong
with
> > an Athlon 64, but it is not significantly better than a Intel P4
Prescott.
>
> An Athlon 64 is much better tham a comparably priced P4 for business
> applications and for many games, as well as many other types of
applications.
> The 32 bit processor you mentioned doesn't run 64 bit software. An
Athlon 64
> is much better than a comparably priced 64 bit Pentium 4 chip for running
64 bit
> software.
>
> http://www.anandtech.com/linux/showdoc.aspx?i=2163&p=1

But, the OP doesn't want to play 3D games, he wants to do video editing.
Who says that he is even going to run a 64bit OS? I'd say that most of the
average users don't even know that many current OS are 32bit, or even know
what it would mean.

>
> Evenly matched? Certainly not for business software.
>
> A 3.2 ghz P4 Prescott is close in price to an Athlon 64 3400+.
> The The Athlon 64 3400+ scored 24.9 in Business Winstone 2004,
> while the P4 3.2 Prescott scored 21.8. Even a $105 Athlon XP 3000+
> beats a $260 P4 3.2 ghz Prescott in Business Winstone 2004.

You can't classify the "Business Software" category with one piece of
software...


> > Please
> > stop bashing Intel.
>
> Why? Am I bashing Intel, or just showing that AMD processors are much
> better alternatives for most people? Many might say that Intel processors
> are good, but that AMD processors provide so much more value at each
> price point.


> > You are doing nobody any favors by doing so.
>
> Perhaps if Intel started pricing their processors more comptatively,
> then an Intel processor might become a more viable option. Many
> knowledgeable people don't want to pay a high price premium when
> buying a processor to help cover Intel's huge marketing costs.
> There are issues that can be discussed. It is silly of you to say
> that AMD processors and comparably priced Intel processors are
> evenly matched, especially when the evidence seems to say that
> there are tremendous differences, and that for the vast najority
> of users, an AMD processor is the more cost effective choice.
> I haven't seen Intel's 64 bit P4 processors on www.pricewatch.com yet.
> It doesn't make any sense for someone to spend more than $150
> for a processor that is only 32 bits. Even at the $150 level, one
> should seriously think about the drawbacks of locking themselves into
> a 32 bit processor. How many people buy a PC with the intention of using
> it for less than a year? A year from now there will probably be plenty of
> X86-64 64 bit software available.

Like I said above, how many people will actually know, or care, about a
64bit OS/Software? Sure, the gamers will, and people who are really into
computers will, but they don't make up the majority of computer users. The
average user isn't going to rush out and buy all of the newest 64bit
software when it comes out.

I just upgraded to a 2.8GHz 800MHz FSB P4, and I don't plan on upgrading
until after college, about 2 years from now. I might not even upgrade than,
because this chip can be overclocked to 3.6GHz easy. My only limitation
right now is RAM. Sure, when I do upgrade, and if the price is right, I
will do 64bit, and it will be Intel, just because I like Intel. I'm not
bashing AMD, it's just personal preference.

> > -Dave
>

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Moderately Confused wrote:

> "JK" <JK9821@netscape.net> wrote in message
> news:411F789F.47B3C73E@netscape.net...
> >
> >
> > "Dave C." wrote:
> >
> > > > Why Intel? Why not an Athlon 64?
> > > >
> > >
> > > Video Editing. For about the thousandth time, there is nothing wrong
> with
> > > an Athlon 64, but it is not significantly better than a Intel P4
> Prescott.
> >
> > An Athlon 64 is much better tham a comparably priced P4 for business
> > applications and for many games, as well as many other types of
> applications.
> > The 32 bit processor you mentioned doesn't run 64 bit software. An
> Athlon 64
> > is much better than a comparably priced 64 bit Pentium 4 chip for running
> 64 bit
> > software.
> >
> > http://www.anandtech.com/linux/showdoc.aspx?i=2163&p=1
>
> But, the OP doesn't want to play 3D games, he wants to do video editing.

LOL! This is what he said.

"My use is mostly office applications (Word, Access, Excel), basic photo
editing, limited video editing,....."

Notice the emphasis on office applications?
The Athlon 64 is a superb performer for business applications.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipse [...] i=2065&p=6


>
> Who says that he is even going to run a 64bit OS? I'd say that most of the
> average users don't even know that many current OS are 32bit, or even know
> what it would mean.

When 64 bit Windows is released, many PC owners who bought a pc
in '04 will become upset that they didn't buy one with a 64 bit processor.
People don't typically use a PC for only 6 months, but for a few years.

>
>
> >
> > Evenly matched? Certainly not for business software.
> >
> > A 3.2 ghz P4 Prescott is close in price to an Athlon 64 3400+.
> > The The Athlon 64 3400+ scored 24.9 in Business Winstone 2004,
> > while the P4 3.2 Prescott scored 21.8. Even a $105 Athlon XP 3000+
> > beats a $260 P4 3.2 ghz Prescott in Business Winstone 2004.
>
> You can't classify the "Business Software" category with one piece of
> software...

It isn't one piece of software. Busineww Winstone 2004 is a benchmark
composed of several important business applications.

http://www.veritest.com/benchmarks [...] wsapps.asp



>
>
> > > Please
> > > stop bashing Intel.
> >
> > Why? Am I bashing Intel, or just showing that AMD processors are much
> > better alternatives for most people? Many might say that Intel processors
> > are good, but that AMD processors provide so much more value at each
> > price point.
>
> > > You are doing nobody any favors by doing so.
> >
> > Perhaps if Intel started pricing their processors more comptatively,
> > then an Intel processor might become a more viable option. Many
> > knowledgeable people don't want to pay a high price premium when
> > buying a processor to help cover Intel's huge marketing costs.
> > There are issues that can be discussed. It is silly of you to say
> > that AMD processors and comparably priced Intel processors are
> > evenly matched, especially when the evidence seems to say that
> > there are tremendous differences, and that for the vast najority
> > of users, an AMD processor is the more cost effective choice.
> > I haven't seen Intel's 64 bit P4 processors on www.pricewatch.com yet.
> > It doesn't make any sense for someone to spend more than $150
> > for a processor that is only 32 bits. Even at the $150 level, one
> > should seriously think about the drawbacks of locking themselves into
> > a 32 bit processor. How many people buy a PC with the intention of using
> > it for less than a year? A year from now there will probably be plenty of
> > X86-64 64 bit software available.
>
> Like I said above, how many people will actually know, or care, about a
> 64bit OS/Software?

In less than a year most will. How many people use a pc for less than a year?

> Sure, the gamers will, and people who are really into
> computers will, but they don't make up the majority of computer users. The
> average user isn't going to rush out and buy all of the newest 64bit
> software when it comes out.

How can you be so certain of that?

>
>
> I just upgraded to a 2.8GHz 800MHz FSB P4, and I don't plan on upgrading
> until after college, about 2 years from now. I might not even upgrade than,
> because this chip can be overclocked to 3.6GHz easy.

Very funny. First you talk about most users, then you talk about overclocking.
Most users don't even know what overclocking is, and the vast majority of
people who do know what overclocking is still don't want to do it.

> My only limitation
> right now is RAM. Sure, when I do upgrade, and if the price is right, I
> will do 64bit, and it will be Intel, just because I like Intel. I'm not
> bashing AMD, it's just personal preference.

So you admit that you can't provide a good reason for someone to use an
Intel processor rather than an AMD processor.

>
>
> > > -Dave
> >

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On Sun, 15 Aug 2004 12:16:19 -0400, JK <JK9821@netscape.net> wrote:

>
>
>Moderately Confused wrote:
>
>> "JK" <JK9821@netscape.net> wrote in message
>> news:411F789F.47B3C73E@netscape.net...
>> >
>> >
>> > "Dave C." wrote:
>> >
>> > > > Why Intel? Why not an Athlon 64?
>> > > >
>> > >
>> > > Video Editing. For about the thousandth time, there is nothing wrong
>> with
>> > > an Athlon 64, but it is not significantly better than a Intel P4
>> Prescott.
>> >
>> > An Athlon 64 is much better tham a comparably priced P4 for business
>> > applications and for many games, as well as many other types of
>> applications.
>> > The 32 bit processor you mentioned doesn't run 64 bit software. An
>> Athlon 64
>> > is much better than a comparably priced 64 bit Pentium 4 chip for running
>> 64 bit
>> > software.
>> >
>> > http://www.anandtech.com/linux/showdoc.aspx?i=2163&p=1
>>
>> But, the OP doesn't want to play 3D games, he wants to do video editing.
>
>LOL! This is what he said.
>
>"My use is mostly office applications (Word, Access, Excel), basic photo
>editing, limited video editing,....."
>
>Notice the emphasis on office applications?
>The Athlon 64 is a superb performer for business applications.
>
>http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2065&p=6
>

I would agree to go with Athlon 64. For intense video editing (such
as movie making), Intel Prescott is a better choice. With either CPU,
the retail version will include a processor fan. I'm not sure which
one runs cooler.