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Yesterday i was helping my father work on a car up at his garage at his
tenement house. While we were fixing the car one of his tenants came out
with a scanner. He showed me the scanner and showed me it was picking up
the cellular bands. I think he said he said he was tuning in somewhere
in the 900 band (902.xxx) ??? I asked him WHAT carrier was the scanner
picking up. He said all.
I don't beleive he was picking up ALL the carriers . But he was
receiving at LEAST one carrier on this modified scanner. Question: How
protected is VZW against these modified scanners ? I had no way of
knowing what carrier(s) he was possibly receiving. I know its NOT legal
to modify and unblock the cellular bands but i just came across this in
the real world.

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It is my understanding that they can only pick up analog cellular.

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On Sun, 29 May 2005 08:44:22 -0400, Norbert_Rocks@webtv.net
(~Norbert~) wrote:

>Yesterday i was helping my father work on a car up at his garage at his
>tenement house. While we were fixing the car one of his tenants came out
>with a scanner. He showed me the scanner and showed me it was picking up
>the cellular bands. I think he said he said he was tuning in somewhere
>in the 900 band (902.xxx) ??? I asked him WHAT carrier was the scanner
>picking up. He said all.
>I don't beleive he was picking up ALL the carriers . But he was
>receiving at LEAST one carrier on this modified scanner. Question: How
>protected is VZW against these modified scanners ? I had no way of
>knowing what carrier(s) he was possibly receiving. I know its NOT legal
>to modify and unblock the cellular bands but i just came across this in
>the real world.

Early models of some scanners (like the Radio Shack Pro-51) had
certain key press sequences that would allow you to tune in
frequencies out of its assigned bands. With scanners like this, you
can tune in the cellular band and pick up the occasional analog call.
Digital calls cannot be picked up and deciphered using these radios.
He may have also been picking up 900mhz *non-digital* cordless phones.

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On Sun, 29 May 2005 08:44:22 -0400, Norbert_Rocks@webtv.net (~Norbert~)
wrote:
>He showed me the scanner and showed me it was picking up
>the cellular bands. I think he said he said he was tuning in somewhere
>in the 900 band (902.xxx) ??? I asked him WHAT carrier was the scanner
>picking up. He said all.

If it was 900 MHz, he was picking up analog cordless phones.

If it was 800 MHz, he was picking up analog cell phones. If your phone
is digital-only, or if you can set it to digital-only, a regular scanner
will not be able to monitor your calls.

--
Bob Scheurle | "There's nobody getting
njtbob@X-verizon-X.net | rich writing software."
Remove X's and dashes | -- Bill Gates, March 1980

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Your dad lives in a tenement house?

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On Sun, 29 May 2005 08:44:22 -0400, Norbert_Rocks@webtv.net (~Norbert~) wrote:

>Yesterday i was helping my father work on a car up at his garage at his
>tenement house. While we were fixing the car one of his tenants came out

>I don't beleive he was picking up ALL the carriers . But he was
>receiving at LEAST one carrier on this modified scanner. Question: How
>protected is VZW against these modified scanners ? I had no way of
>knowing what carrier(s) he was possibly receiving. I know its NOT legal
>to modify and unblock the cellular bands but i just came across this in
>the real world.
More than likely he was receiving a cordless phone not a cellular phone.

Scanners made prior to 1984 could easily receive the OLD ANALOG AMPS cell phone
systems between 861-896/824-851. Scanners made after 1984 had this band locked
out. In some it was as simple as a few keystrokes to restore, others required a
little electronic surgery and were quickly back to scanning this area.

Modern ones have this area locked out in the firmware similar to a PC BIOS in
ROM that can not be modified.

In the US it is ILLEGAL to monitor cellular phone systems, analog (AMPS) or
digital (CDMA, TDMA, iDEN, GSM). Monitoring the more prevalent digital systems
would require a very expensive device called a service monitor, NEW $20,000.00 +
USED $7,000.00 and up.

If this was in the 902-928 band then he was monitoring analog cordless phones,
just like you can do the same for the older model phones in the 46-50MHz region.
Also some 2.4GHz & 5.8GHz phones are analog and can be monitored if the radio
covers these bands, some of the more high end ones do.

If you have a DIGITAL cellular phone your not likely to be monitored by just Joe
Scanner, these can be monitored quite easily with the right equipment.

If you have a cordless phone make sure it says DIGITAL SPREAD SPRECTUM or DSS or
DSSS or FSSSH on it other wise its monitorable


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xxnonexnonexx@tampascanner.info wrote in
news:rdgk9112bo4fjqa8tleane80tnb0s84n4d@4ax.com:

> Scanners made prior to 1984 could easily receive the OLD ANALOG AMPS
> cell phone systems between 861-896/824-851. Scanners made after 1984
> had this band locked out. In some it was as simple as a few keystrokes
> to restore, others required a little electronic surgery and were
> quickly back to scanning this area.
>

The government scanners (FBI, CIA, IRS) all listen to your CDMA signal.....

They're a LOT more dangerous than Dad would ever be. After 9/11 they don't
even need a judge's permission to listen in the name of "Homeland
Security", the Gestapo's new arm.

Be careful what you say.....

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~Norbert~ wrote:
> Yesterday i was helping my father work on a car up at his garage at his
> tenement house. While we were fixing the car one of his tenants came out
> with a scanner. He showed me the scanner and showed me it was picking up
> the cellular bands. I think he said he said he was tuning in somewhere
> in the 900 band (902.xxx) ??? I asked him WHAT carrier was the scanner
> picking up. He said all.

If it was the 900MHz band, then he probably wasn't picking up ANY
cellular carriers. Instead, he was picking up analog 900Mhz cordless
phones hooked up to the wireline network, the common variety of cordless
landline phones you can buy at wal-mart and radioshack. It's likely
quite a few people have these in the surrounding neighborhood, and their
signal can carry a surprisingly long distance. But, it was highly
unlikely that any of those signals he was picking up were cellular.

> I don't beleive he was picking up ALL the carriers . But he was
> receiving at LEAST one carrier on this modified scanner. Question: How
> protected is VZW against these modified scanners ? I had no way of
> knowing what carrier(s) he was possibly receiving. I know its NOT legal
> to modify and unblock the cellular bands but i just came across this in
> the real world.

Assuming someone actually does have a modified scanner that can pick up
the cellular band, the chances of picking up present-day signals is
becoming more and more slim as time passes. VZW, Cingular, AT&T and
other networks that have licenses in the 800MHz cellular band are
radpily converting to all digital, with a "sunset date" for required
analog capability of January 1, 2007. And carriers in the 1.9GHz band
(Sprint, T-Mobile, and the newer portions of Verizon and Cingular) were
always digital, so there is nothing to worry about there.

In layman's terms: a modified scanner could only pick up analog cellular
transmissions, and those are becoming more and more scarce as time
passes. "Old school" cellular companies that have been around for
awhile usually have one or two channels per cell site on their networks
that are still analog to accomodate roaming and people with older
phones, but the vast majority of cellular traffic nowadays is digital.
Scanners, however, are only capable of picking up the narrowband FM type
of signal that analog service transmits. If you use that same scanner
to pick up a digital signal, all you'll hear is a high frequency hiss or
buzz, instead of conversations. In fact, the newer technology (CDMA
1xRTT, EV-DO, and UMTS) has an analog "sound" that sounds a lot like
plain old static.

So as long as you have a digital cell phone (CDMA, TDMA, iDEN or GSM)
and make calls in digital mode only, you're very safe from the average
Joe eavesdropping with a scanner. If you stick with carriers like
Sprint, T-Mobile or Nextel, then you're virtually guaranteed protection
from such eavesdroppiung, as these carriers never did and never do offer
analog service.

As far as landline cordless phones go (which is what your friend was
probably picking up), you're still safe as long as you avoid the 900Mhz
analog models, and instead use a 2.4GHz or 5.8GHz Digital Spread
Spectrum (DSS) phone. Such phones use an encryption method very similar
to Verizon and Sprint's CDMA digital cellular service, and are just as
difficult to decode and eavesdrop on.

Of course, if you're conducting the type of business that government
agencies might be interested in, then all bets about eavesdropping are
off. But usually they have other, more direct methods for intercepting
phone calls at the cellular switch, rather than using an over-the-air
method for picking up your calls.



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Larry W4CSC wrote:



> The government scanners (FBI, CIA, IRS) all listen to your CDMA signal.....

Actually, listening in on CDMA is harder than you think, and only
getting harder as the vocoders get more diverse (QCELP 8k/13k, EVRC, and
the new packetized vocoders coming out for EVDO Rev a) . But no matter.
The government generally has NO INTEREST in monitoring the *signal*.
They don't have to. It's way easier for them to just tap your line at
the MTSO and get a much more reliable, better quality recording of your
calls that way, and they don't even have to follow you around with an
antenna.

> They're a LOT more dangerous than Dad would ever be. After 9/11 they don't
> even need a judge's permission to listen in the name of "Homeland
> Security", the Gestapo's new arm.
>
> Be careful what you say.....

You keep wearin' your foil hat, Larry.



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analog is optional for Cellular providers on Feb 18, 2008

It is against the law today to listen to the Cellular Band

It is very illegal to listen in digital very hard to do on CDMA.
Government like (FCC, FBI, CIA) in my opinion should not monitor your
calls unless you are under an investigation or someone not a US citizen
with a suspicion of committing a crime.

Sometimes a road to hell is paved on good intentions.


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Isaiah Beard <sacredpoet@sacredpoet.com> wrote in
news:119lc80ba2uk1b5@corp.supernews.com:

> You keep wearin' your foil hat, Larry.
>

No....My cell antenna doesn't require a groundplane...(c;

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On Mon, 30 May 2005 02:02:05 -0400, Isaiah Beard
<sacredpoet@sacredpoet.com> wrote:
>As far as landline cordless phones go (which is what your friend was
>probably picking up), you're still safe as long as you avoid the 900Mhz
>analog models, and instead use a 2.4GHz or 5.8GHz Digital Spread
>Spectrum (DSS) phone.

You make it sound like all 900 MHz phones are analog and all 2.4/5.8 GHz
phones are digital. That's not true. I had a digital 900 MHz phone, and
some 2.4/5.8 GHz phones are analog.

>Such phones use an encryption method very similar
>to Verizon and Sprint's CDMA digital cellular service, and are just as
>difficult to decode and eavesdrop on.

I would not call spread spectrum transmission an "encryption method".

--
Bob Scheurle | "There's nobody getting
njtbob@X-verizon-X.net | rich writing software."
Remove X's and dashes | -- Bill Gates, March 1980

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Bob Scheurle wrote:
> On Mon, 30 May 2005 02:02:05 -0400, Isaiah Beard
> <sacredpoet@sacredpoet.com> wrote:
>
>>As far as landline cordless phones go (which is what your friend was
>>probably picking up), you're still safe as long as you avoid the 900Mhz
>>analog models, and instead use a 2.4GHz or 5.8GHz Digital Spread
>>Spectrum (DSS) phone.
>
>
> You make it sound like all 900 MHz phones are analog and all 2.4/5.8 GHz
> phones are digital.


No, I specifically stated he needs to pick up a *DSS* phone in the 2.4
GHz or 5.8GHz band. I'd appreciate it if you didn't read more into my
posts than is there.


>>Such phones use an encryption method very similar
>>to Verizon and Sprint's CDMA digital cellular service, and are just as
>>difficult to decode and eavesdrop on.
>
>
> I would not call spread spectrum transmission an "encryption method".

Encryption: 1. The use of an algorithmic process to transform data into
a form in which there is a low probability of assigning meaning without
use of a process or key. 2. The process of obscuring information to
make it unreadable without special knowledge.

The primary purpose of spread spectrum technology in cordless phones is
to obscure the transmission to eavesdroppers and ensure a reasonable
level of privacy. That seems to count as a form of encryption.

Now is there anything else about my posts you'd like to misconstrue?


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I thought the primary purpose of cdma wireless phones was account
security and getting past interference. Lower power and privacy are
added benefits.

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