Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

When one browses thru the cell-phones by manufacturer, via
the link: http://www.cellphonemall.net/
one sees various models of cell-phones (e.g. Motorola and Samsung)
with the designation:

'(unlocked)'

Can someone explain what that means?

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

David Cook wrote:
> When one browses thru the cell-phones by manufacturer, via
> the link: http://www.cellphonemall.net/
> one sees various models of cell-phones (e.g. Motorola and Samsung)
> with the designation:
>
> '(unlocked)'
>
> Can someone explain what that means?

AFAIK, that means that the security code is given or set to a default,
so the user can access the advanced settings.

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

gk.latv@excite.com wrote:

> David Cook wrote:
>> When one browses thru the cell-phones by manufacturer, via
>> the link: http://www.cellphonemall.net/
>> one sees various models of cell-phones (e.g. Motorola and Samsung)
>> with the designation:
>>
>> '(unlocked)'
>>
>> Can someone explain what that means?
>
> AFAIK, that means that the security code is given or set to a default,
> so the user can access the advanced settings.

I think it means that the phones are not "locked" to a particular carrier
(Cingular, AT&T etc.) Most common with GSM phones - you can just get a SIM
card and give them your IMEI number and you can use the phone with a new
carrier (if the phone is not locked).

I have noticed that carrier locking is especially prevalent in the US -
since they give you the phone free (or close to) in return for a long
contract. They have to recover the cost of the phone!

my 2 cents.

bp

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Makes perfect sense, so far.

Ok, so how does one UNLOCK a phone that is LOCKED?

(I'm sure it's about money. Who does one pay to unlock a phone?
[An extra monthly fee, right?]
Why do I feel like we've all been thrown a 'curve ball'?
I'd argue that we OWN the phones, so why can providers
hold us in ransom by providing us with locked phones? [Pretty
soon, Microsoft will start selling us copies of the Windows that we
can NOT install software on until we pay an extra ransom?]
Does anyone have the phone number for the Federal Trade Commission?)

I smell a rat.

(Luckily, we have a 14-day trial period with the new 2-year service
contract.
Unless I hear some good answers from Verizon, our new one is gonna have the
plug pulled.)





<gk.latv@excite.com> wrote in message
news:1102505881.993225.142650@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
> David Cook wrote:
>> When one browses thru the cell-phones by manufacturer, via
>> the link: http://www.cellphonemall.net/
>> one sees various models of cell-phones (e.g. Motorola and Samsung)
>> with the designation:
>>
>> '(unlocked)'
>>
>> Can someone explain what that means?
>
> AFAIK, that means that the security code is given or set to a default,
> so the user can access the advanced settings.
>

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

The same way that a cellular carrier charges you for minutes whether you use
them or not. Cingular is the only one that lets you roll over minutes which
should be the case for all the carriers. I am on Verizon simply because of
coverage. If Cingular was worth much in WI i would be on that system for the
minute rollover.

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"David Cook" <someone@microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:tNGdnfZTaJchkSrcRVn-uw@comcast.com...
> Makes perfect sense, so far.
>
> Ok, so how does one UNLOCK a phone that is LOCKED?
>
> (I'm sure it's about money. Who does one pay to unlock a phone?
> [An extra monthly fee, right?]
> Why do I feel like we've all been thrown a 'curve ball'?
> I'd argue that we OWN the phones, so why can providers
> hold us in ransom by providing us with locked phones? [Pretty
> soon, Microsoft will start selling us copies of the Windows that we
> can NOT install software on until we pay an extra ransom?]
> Does anyone have the phone number for the Federal Trade Commission?)
>
> I smell a rat.
>
> (Luckily, we have a 14-day trial period with the new 2-year service
> contract.
> Unless I hear some good answers from Verizon, our new one is gonna have
> the plug pulled.)
>
>
>
>
>
> <gk.latv@excite.com> wrote in message
> news:1102505881.993225.142650@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
>> David Cook wrote:
>>> When one browses thru the cell-phones by manufacturer, via
>>> the link: http://www.cellphonemall.net/
>>> one sees various models of cell-phones (e.g. Motorola and Samsung)
>>> with the designation:
>>>
>>> '(unlocked)'
>>>
>>> Can someone explain what that means?
>>
>> AFAIK, that means that the security code is given or set to a default,
>> so the user can access the advanced settings.
>>
>
>

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On Wed, 8 Dec 2004 03:27:04 -0500, "David Cook"
<someone@microsoft.com> wrote:

>When one browses thru the cell-phones by manufacturer, via
>the link: http://www.cellphonemall.net/
>one sees various models of cell-phones (e.g. Motorola and Samsung)
>with the designation:
>
> '(unlocked)'
>
>Can someone explain what that means?

In general that's referring to GSM phones. Many phones sold in the US
as well as other countries are "SIM" locked meaning that you can only
use the SIM (smart card) issued by the carrier where you bought the
phone. If you attempt to use a SIM from another network the phone
will give the message "SIM rejected" or similar. Phones are SIM
locked because the carrier subsidizes the phone's cost to help
convince subscribers to join their network. Since SIMs can be used in
any compatible phone (mostly compatible frequency) the carrier that
sold the phone doesn't want their subscriber getting a free or heavily
subsidized phone and then going to the competition with the phone that
they helped purchase.

Generally unlocked does not apply to non-GSM phones though carriers do
often use a SOC lock to prevent complete compatibility of their phones
(which they also subsidize) from being used on similar networks. An
example is that Sprint PCS and Cricket use the same technology phones
but Sprint PCS and Cricket put some sort of lock on the phones so you
can't provision them on another CDMA service such as Verizon's. Qwest
also does this and probably other CDMA carriers. AT&T Wireless on
TDMA does the same thing in that they have a SOC lock on their phones
so using them on cingular with the same technology usually isn't
possible. Also it's often the policy of CDMA and TDMA providers that
they will not activate a handset on their system that they didn't
either sell or is in their database of ESNs. What I've said about SOC
locks may have another term, but don't recall it at the moment.

Bottom line though is that in ads for phones if you see "unlocked"
it's most usually referring to GSM models only.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

David Cook wrote:
>
> (Luckily, we have a 14-day trial period with the new 2-year service
> contract.
> Unless I hear some good answers from Verizon, our new one is gonna
have the
> plug pulled.)
>
Verizon usually does not lock their phones. In most cases, your phone's
last 4- digit is a default security code. There should be a paragraph
in the phone's user guide mentioning that. As said before, the security
code would give you access to the advanced features menu, where you can
"reprogram" your phone, including setting for a different (but still
CDMA) provider.
One example of locked phone would be a prepay phone/service. The phone
would be locked, because some phone features might be disabled, and the
provider does not want you to enable them.

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On Wed, 8 Dec 2004 09:16:28 -0500, "David Cook"
<someone@microsoft.com> wrote:

>Makes perfect sense, so far.
>
>Ok, so how does one UNLOCK a phone that is LOCKED?

Either entering an unlock code which is either provided by the
original carrier or for some phones you can go to web sites that offer
unlocking code calculators or even have on line unlocking code
calculators. Some places charge for "remote unlocking." The other
alternative is to find someone who can unlock for you either by
obtaining the code or "flashing/flexing" the phone to remove the lock.

>(I'm sure it's about money. Who does one pay to unlock a phone?
>[An extra monthly fee, right?]

People advertise this service. Yes, it usually involves money if you
have someone else do the work (provide the code or flash the phone.)

>Why do I feel like we've all been thrown a 'curve ball'?
>I'd argue that we OWN the phones, so why can providers
>hold us in ransom by providing us with locked phones?

Because you haven't paid the full price of the phone! The carrier has
subsidized the cost of the phone. Often times carriers (some of them
at any rate) will provide the unlock code for you provided either a
fixed amount of time has elapsed or you pay a small amount of money to
obtain the code. That's the reason why if you look for GSM phones not
sold by carriers from independent dealers the pricing may be several
hundred dollars for phones with many features (camera, blue tooth,
etc.) Often times the carrier will either give away phones or
severely discount them provided you sign up for a two year contract.

The phone manufacturers do not give the phones away for free. The
carriers have to pay for them.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

I also want to mention that in addition to security code, the phone
also has a master lock code. Most likely, the "locked/unlocked" term
refers to this master lock code (6 digits -?). This master lock code
would actually give you the access to the advanced menus I was talking
about. The security code lets you to reset your phone and minute
timers.
Sorry about the confusion.

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Joseph wrote:
> On Wed, 8 Dec 2004 09:16:28 -0500, "David Cook"
> <someone@microsoft.com> wrote:
>
SNIP
>> Why do I feel like we've all been thrown a 'curve ball'?
>> I'd argue that we OWN the phones, so why can providers
>> hold us in ransom by providing us with locked phones?
>
> Because you haven't paid the full price of the phone! The carrier
> has subsidized the cost of the phone.
snip
>Often times the carrier will
> either give away phones or severely discount them provided you sign
> up for a two year contract.
>
> The phone manufacturers do not give the phones away for free. The
> carriers have to pay for them.


Certainly true enough. My new CDM9900 cost me only $20, plus the tax based
on Verizon's normal retail price ($229?) at the time (I got it discounted to
$170). Naturally, I've seen much higher -suggested- retail pricing. For
the plan I'm on ($35 per month) + ($2.99 SMS) ... well you do the math.
--

- Philip

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

>
> Certainly true enough. My new CDM9900 cost me only $20, plus the tax
> based on Verizon's normal retail price ($229?) at the time (I got it
> discounted to $170). Naturally, I've seen much higher -suggested- retail
> pricing. For the plan I'm on ($35 per month) + ($2.99 SMS) ... well you
> do the math.
> --
>
> - Philip
>
>


The FAQ on Motorola's website
http://commerce.motorola.com/consumer/QWhtml/faq.html
says that their phones ship with a lock-code of 1234.
If that doesn't work, it says a technician can unlock the phone,
by discovering the existing lock-code using special equipment.

However, the tech-support guy at Verizon Wireless is skeptical
whether their techs will do it. Somehow, it seems this confilicts with
their $4.95 monthly-charge for 'Mobile Web' feature, which seems
to be why they are locking up the phones in the first place.

So, make sure you resolve this with
the 14-day bailout period if this is important to you.

A 'sim-card' also has something to do with it all, whatever that is!?

JD

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Joseph wrote:

> In general that's referring to GSM phones.

It's certainly more common with GSM phones, but there seem to be a fair number
of CDMA carriers that do it too. Alltel and Verizon are the only CDMA carriers
that I know for sure don't lock their phones.

Nextel may or may not. Only Nextel, Southern Linc and one or two other Nextel
affiliates, and one of the Canadian carriers run iDen networks so there's much
less of a benefit to having an unlocked iDen phone anyhow.

(I believe Clearnet is the Canadian iDen carrier, they do PCS too)

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Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Jude the dude wrote:
>> Certainly true enough. My new CDM9900 cost me only $20, plus the
>> tax based on Verizon's normal retail price ($229?) at the time (I
>> got it discounted to $170). Naturally, I've seen much higher
>> -suggested- retail pricing. For the plan I'm on ($35 per month) +
>> ($2.99 SMS) ... well you do the math.
>> --
>>
>> - Philip
>
> The FAQ on Motorola's website
> http://commerce.motorola.com/consumer/QWhtml/faq.html
> says that their phones ship with a lock-code of 1234.
> If that doesn't work, it says a technician can unlock the phone,
> by discovering the existing lock-code using special equipment.
>
> However, the tech-support guy at Verizon Wireless is skeptical
> whether their techs will do it. Somehow, it seems this confilicts
> with their $4.95 monthly-charge for 'Mobile Web' feature, which
> seems to be why they are locking up the phones in the first place.
>
> So, make sure you resolve this with
> the 14-day bailout period if this is important to you.
>
> A 'sim-card' also has something to do with it all, whatever that
> is!?
> JD

Depending on the phone (of course), as you say 1,2,3,4 or ... the last four
digits of the phone number will unlock things.
--

- Philip

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

>Joseph wrote:
>Alltel and Verizon are the only CDMA carriers that I know for sure don't
>lock their phones.

I think you must mean 'who DO lock their phones', right?

I have two phones from Verizon, and they are both locked.
(Which frustrates me immensely, as I'm trying to learn how to
load Java software into a cell-phone, and this lockout keeps
me from using WAP to load software into the phone.)

Any developers out here who can enlighten me if there are OTHER
ways to load software into a Motorola phone BESIDE using WAP?

e.g. is it possible to use a data-cable to load a Java-app into a locked
Motorola phone?

TIA...

Dave