Archived from groups: alt.internet.wireless (More info?)

Hi,
I am going to buy a couple of LinkSys WRT54GS wireless routers to set up
an external wi-fi bridge (about 340 meters).

I will put the LinkSys routers on the roofs of the two houses and I want
to bring them the electrical power with the ethernet cable (power over
ethernet).

How can I do that?
Is there any kit I can buy?

I have another quick question: is the LinkSys power adapter
multi-standard (110 to 230 V)?

Thanks a lot.

Archived from groups: alt.internet.wireless (More info?)

meATprivacyDOTnet thought carefully and wrote on 10/11/2004 3:07 AM:
<snip>
> I have another quick question: is the LinkSys power adapter
> multi-standard (110 to 230 V)?

Can't answer your other questions about the WRT54GS, but my WRT54GS
plug-in type transformer/power supply is single input only.

Input - 120VAC, 60Hz, 23W.
Output - 12VDC, 1000mA.

Lance
*****

Archived from groups: alt.internet.wireless (More info?)

meATprivacyDOTnet wrote:




> Hi,
> I am going to buy a couple of LinkSys WRT54GS wireless routers to set
> up
> an external wi-fi bridge (about 340 meters).

> I will put the LinkSys routers on the roofs of the two houses and I
> want
> to bring them the electrical power with the ethernet cable (power over
> ethernet).

> How can I do that?
> Is there any kit I can buy?

> I have another quick question: is the LinkSys power adapter
> multi-standard (110 to 230 V)?

> Thanks a lot.

These are not POE-comliant (IEEE 802.3af) devices, so you will not be
able to buy a ready-made midspan power source. However, you can still make
yourself a couple of adapters out of RJ45 jacks and 3.5 mm coaxial power
plugs. pairs #1 and #4 are not used in a 10/100 Ehternet connection, so
you can solder, say #1 (white/blue-blue) to ground and #4
(white/brown-brown) to the plus ends of your power plugs. If you are
running very long wires, you may have to use higher voltage wall power
supplies to accommodate for the voltage drop in the UTP cable

--
Dmitri Abaimov, RCDD
http://www.cabling-design.com
Cabling Forum, color codes, pinouts and other useful resources for
premises cabling users and pros
http://www.cabling-design.com/homecabling
Residential Cabling Guide
-------------------------------------





##-----------------------------------------------##
Article posted with Cabling-Design.com Newsgroup Archive
http://www.cabling-design.com/forums
no-spam read and post WWW interface to your favorite newsgroup -
alt.internet.wireless - 1271 messages and counting!
##-----------------------------------------------##

Archived from groups: alt.internet.wireless (More info?)

Yeah, the Screen Savers did something like that on their G4/TechTV show last
week I think. You might want to go up on their website and read their
article on it. I think they said they got it from another source and will
probably give a website for it.


"meATprivacyDOTnet" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:2sv4baF1no611U1@uni-berlin.de...
> Hi,
> I am going to buy a couple of LinkSys WRT54GS wireless routers to set up
> an external wi-fi bridge (about 340 meters).
>
> I will put the LinkSys routers on the roofs of the two houses and I want
> to bring them the electrical power with the ethernet cable (power over
> ethernet).
>
> How can I do that?
> Is there any kit I can buy?
>
> I have another quick question: is the LinkSys power adapter multi-standard
> (110 to 230 V)?
>
> Thanks a lot.

Archived from groups: alt.internet.wireless (More info?)

On Mon, 11 Oct 2004 12:07:38 +0200, meATprivacyDOTnet <me@privacy.net>
wrote:

>I am going to buy a couple of LinkSys WRT54GS wireless routers to set up
>an external wi-fi bridge (about 340 meters).

I don't thin the WRT54GS will play transparent bridge. Methinks the
WAP54G is what you probably want. If you only want to bridge one
computah, then the WRT54GS at one end, and just about anything on the
other end, will work.

>I will put the LinkSys routers on the roofs of the two houses and I want
>to bring them the electrical power with the ethernet cable (power over
>ethernet).
>
>How can I do that?
>Is there any kit I can buy?

Linksys WAPPOE
http://www.linksys.com/products/pr [...] 82&scid=38
Note the list of supported products. I find it interesting that the
WRT54G is supported. The WAPPOE box outputs 5VDC while the Linksys
WRT54G allegedly runs on 12VDC. Well the answer is that the WRT54G
will run on just about anything between 5VDC and about 18VDC. That's
because internally, it runs on 3.3VDC and has a very nice internal
switching regulator (low dropout voltage). The original WRT54G was
supplied with a 5VDC wall wart and had a really small voltage
regulator, while later models came with 12VDC wall warts and a big
TO-220 size regulator.
http://www.linksysinfo.com/modules [...] page&pid=6

The wide voltage range also means that you can easily build your own
PoE contraption and tolerate quite a bit of voltage loss in the CAT5
cableing. If you can get 5VDC or more up the pole, it will work.
See:
http://www.gweep.net/%7Esfoskett/tech/poecalc.html
for calculating the losses. I think (not sure) the WRT54G uses 0.6A
at 12VDC (or about 7 watts). With a switching regulator, the power
dissipation is fairly constant, regardless of input voltage.
Therefore, at 5VDC input, the box would draw about 1.5A.

Oh yeah, how to build your own PoE adapter.
http://www.nycwireless.net/poe/

>I have another quick question: is the LinkSys power adapter
>multi-standard (110 to 230 V)?

No. Looks like different wall warts for 117 and 230VAC.


--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@comix.santa-cruz.ca.us
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 AE6KS 831-336-2558

Archived from groups: alt.internet.wireless (More info?)

Linksys make a POE kit for the WRT54G.
Check out
http://www.linksys.com/products/pr [...] 7&prid=582



"meATprivacyDOTnet" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:2sv4baF1no611U1@uni-berlin.de...
> Hi,
> I am going to buy a couple of LinkSys WRT54GS wireless routers to set up
> an external wi-fi bridge (about 340 meters).
>
> I will put the LinkSys routers on the roofs of the two houses and I want
> to bring them the electrical power with the ethernet cable (power over
> ethernet).
>
> How can I do that?
> Is there any kit I can buy?
>
> I have another quick question: is the LinkSys power adapter multi-standard
> (110 to 230 V)?
>
> Thanks a lot.

Archived from groups: alt.internet.wireless (More info?)

I dunno about the 5VDC part and the WRT54GS. When I first set up my
WRT54GS, I tried the 5VDC supply that came with my BEFw11s4 v2 (too lazy
to untangle the cords under the desk) - didn't work, no lights.

Of course the WRT54GS did start right up when the 12VDC "wall wart"
was used.

Lance
*****

Jeff Liebermann thought carefully and wrote on 10/11/2004 9:46 AM:
> On Mon, 11 Oct 2004 12:07:38 +0200, meATprivacyDOTnet <me@privacy.net>
> wrote:
>
>
>>I am going to buy a couple of LinkSys WRT54GS wireless routers to set up
>>an external wi-fi bridge (about 340 meters).
>
>
> I don't thin the WRT54GS will play transparent bridge. Methinks the
> WAP54G is what you probably want. If you only want to bridge one
> computah, then the WRT54GS at one end, and just about anything on the
> other end, will work.
>
>
>>I will put the LinkSys routers on the roofs of the two houses and I want
>>to bring them the electrical power with the ethernet cable (power over
>>ethernet).
>>
>>How can I do that?
>>Is there any kit I can buy?
>
>
> Linksys WAPPOE
> http://www.linksys.com/products/pr [...] 82&scid=38
> Note the list of supported products. I find it interesting that the
> WRT54G is supported. The WAPPOE box outputs 5VDC while the Linksys
> WRT54G allegedly runs on 12VDC. Well the answer is that the WRT54G
> will run on just about anything between 5VDC and about 18VDC. That's
> because internally, it runs on 3.3VDC and has a very nice internal
> switching regulator (low dropout voltage). The original WRT54G was
> supplied with a 5VDC wall wart and had a really small voltage
> regulator, while later models came with 12VDC wall warts and a big
> TO-220 size regulator.
> http://www.linksysinfo.com/modules [...] page&pid=6
>
> The wide voltage range also means that you can easily build your own
> PoE contraption and tolerate quite a bit of voltage loss in the CAT5
> cableing. If you can get 5VDC or more up the pole, it will work.
> See:
> http://www.gweep.net/%7Esfoskett/tech/poecalc.html
> for calculating the losses. I think (not sure) the WRT54G uses 0.6A
> at 12VDC (or about 7 watts). With a switching regulator, the power
> dissipation is fairly constant, regardless of input voltage.
> Therefore, at 5VDC input, the box would draw about 1.5A.
>
> Oh yeah, how to build your own PoE adapter.
> http://www.nycwireless.net/poe/
>
>
>>I have another quick question: is the LinkSys power adapter
>>multi-standard (110 to 230 V)?
>
>
> No. Looks like different wall warts for 117 and 230VAC.
>
>

Archived from groups: alt.internet.wireless (More info?)

On Mon, 11 Oct 2004 17:01:40 -0700, Lance <lltbhill@link_earth.net>
wrote:

>I dunno about the 5VDC part and the WRT54GS. When I first set up my
>WRT54GS, I tried the 5VDC supply that came with my BEFw11s4 v2 (too lazy
>to untangle the cords under the desk) - didn't work, no lights.
>
>Of course the WRT54GS did start right up when the 12VDC "wall wart"
>was used.

Oops, y'er partly right. Thanks.
Methinks I see what happened. The various photos at:
http://www.linksysinfo.com/modules [...] page&pid=6
don't look anything like the photo on the FCC web pile
(FCCID: Q87-WRT54GP2):
https://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/oet/ [...] or_pdf=pdf
Note the much larger number of components including the *DUAL* TO-220
case 5 terminal switching regulators. The ones in the photo from
Linksysinfo site show single regulators. I guess(tm) there are
variations in the design. I know for sure that a WRT54G v1.1 will
work at about 7-8VDC because I have one running on a pole. No clue on
the v2.0 flavour but I can try it in a few days.

Incidentally, unlike your BEFW11S4 v2 incantation, my BEFW11S4 v4 uses
a 12VDC 1A wall wart. Do you see a trend here? Just for fun, I'll
stick it on a variable voltage power supply and try it at lower
voltages. It's not the same as the WRT54G, but it would still be
interesting. If I'm wrong....well, I don't wanna think about it.

Drivel: I guess PoE is nice because it only uses one cable, but for
home use, maybe running a 2nd CAT5 cable and using it solely for power
might be much easier than the RJ45 connector wiring pretzel.


--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@comix.santa-cruz.ca.us
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 AE6KS 831-336-2558

Archived from groups: alt.internet.wireless (More info?)

On Mon, 11 Oct 2004 18:02:39 -0700, Jeff Liebermann
<jeffl@comix.santa-cruz.ca.us> wrote:

>Incidentally, unlike your BEFW11S4 v2 incantation, my BEFW11S4 v4 uses
>a 12VDC 1A wall wart. Do you see a trend here? Just for fun, I'll
>stick it on a variable voltage power supply and try it at lower
>voltages. It's not the same as the WRT54G, but it would still be
>interesting. If I'm wrong....well, I don't wanna think about it.

I'm right. The BEFW11S4 v4 stock wall wart is 12VDC 1A, but the unit
works just fine down 3.7VDC at 0.7A. See:
http://www.LearnByDestroying.com/p [...] -volt.html
The power supply is a bit difficult to read, but full scale is 6VDC.
I had no problems with startup at 3.7VDC.

This is obviously not the same as a WRT54G or your v2 model, but my
guess(tm) is that the internal switching power supply designs are
similar. The problem might have been that your 5VDC wall wart was
gutless and could not supply the necessary current. At 5VDC, I
measure 0.62A. So much for that idea as I think the Linksys 5VDC wall
warts are 1.5A to 3.0A. Try it again.

Anyways, with such a huge allowable voltage DC input voltage range,
you could just run almost any type of wire from the stock 12VDC wall
wart and almost ignore the copper losses.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@comix.santa-cruz.ca.us
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 AE6KS 831-336-2558

Archived from groups: alt.internet.wireless (More info?)

Jeff Liebermann thought carefully and wrote on 10/11/2004 6:41 PM:
> On Mon, 11 Oct 2004 18:02:39 -0700, Jeff Liebermann
> <jeffl@comix.santa-cruz.ca.us> wrote:
>
>
>>Incidentally, unlike your BEFW11S4 v2 incantation, my BEFW11S4 v4 uses
>>a 12VDC 1A wall wart. Do you see a trend here? Just for fun, I'll
>>stick it on a variable voltage power supply and try it at lower
>>voltages. It's not the same as the WRT54G, but it would still be
>>interesting. If I'm wrong....well, I don't wanna think about it.
>
>
> I'm right. The BEFW11S4 v4 stock wall wart is 12VDC 1A, but the unit
> works just fine down 3.7VDC at 0.7A. See:
> http://www.LearnByDestroying.com/p [...] -volt.html
> The power supply is a bit difficult to read, but full scale is 6VDC.
> I had no problems with startup at 3.7VDC.
>
> This is obviously not the same as a WRT54G or your v2 model, but my
> guess(tm) is that the internal switching power supply designs are
> similar. The problem might have been that your 5VDC wall wart was
> gutless and could not supply the necessary current. At 5VDC, I
> measure 0.62A. So much for that idea as I think the Linksys 5VDC wall
> warts are 1.5A to 3.0A. Try it again.
>
> Anyways, with such a huge allowable voltage DC input voltage range,
> you could just run almost any type of wire from the stock 12VDC wall
> wart and almost ignore the copper losses.

The supply that came with the BEFW11S4 v2 has these specs on the unit:

Input: 100-240V 50/60Hz 0.5A
Output: DC5.0V 2.5A

I tried it again and am embarrassed to see that the WRT54GS does indeed
work with this 5VDC supply. I don't know what happened the first time.

Lance
*****

Archived from groups: alt.internet.wireless (More info?)

On Mon, 11 Oct 2004 19:45:37 -0700, Lance <lltbhill@link_earth.net>
wrote:

>The supply that came with the BEFW11S4 v2 has these specs on the unit:
> Input: 100-240V 50/60Hz 0.5A
> Output: DC5.0V 2.5A

That should be more than enough to supply the necessary 0.7A at 5VDC.

Drivel: I have a large number of totally dead 5VDC 3A power supplies
in the office that came from mostly Netgear and Edimax boxes. No clue
why they died, but these are the only dead wall warts that I've seen
in several years. It makes me wonder if there was a bad batch of 5VDC
wall warts and Linksys substituted 12VDC versions because they were
more reliable (or cheaper). Dunno.

>I tried it again and am embarrassed to see that the WRT54GS does indeed
>work with this 5VDC supply. I don't know what happened the first time.

Oh good. I just hate being wrong. When that happens, I get very
depressed, tend to stop answering questions, and revert back to doing
paying work, cleaning the house, shovelling office paperwork, and
generally doing useful things. It's good to know that I won't have to
do all that.


--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@comix.santa-cruz.ca.us
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 AE6KS 831-336-2558

Archived from groups: alt.internet.wireless (More info?)

On 10/11/04 5:08 PM, Mike wrote:
> Yeah, the Screen Savers did something like that on their G4/TechTV show last
> week I think. You might want to go up on their website and read their
> article on it. I think they said they got it from another source and will
> probably give a website for it.

I went to their website
(<http://www.g4techtv.com/screensavers/index.html> ), but I couldn't find
anything about the LinkSys wireless router ...

Do you have a direct link?

Thanks.

Archived from groups: alt.internet.wireless (More info?)

On 10/11/04 6:46 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

> I don't thin the WRT54GS will play transparent bridge. Methinks the
> WAP54G is what you probably want. If you only want to bridge one
> computah, then the WRT54GS at one end, and just about anything on the
> other end, will work.

You are right: the WRT54GS doesn't seem to support bridging with the
official LinkSys firmware, but it looks like the unofficial Sveasoft
firmware adds that functionality:
<http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11069890>

Here is a bridging HOWTO for the WRT54G, it should work fine for the
WRT54GS too, since the Sveasoft firmware is the basically same for both
routers:
<http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,10682572>

It looks like the bridging feature is WDS compliant.

Do you think it will work fine and have similar performances to the WAP54G?

I would like to buy the WRT54GS over the WAP54G because it has better
hardware: faster CPU, more flash memory, more RAM ...

Also, it has the SpeedBooster feature.

Thanks.

Archived from groups: alt.internet.wireless (More info?)

On 10/12/04 5:21 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
> On Mon, 11 Oct 2004 19:45:37 -0700, Lance <lltbhill@link_earth.net>
> wrote:
>
>
>>The supply that came with the BEFW11S4 v2 has these specs on the unit:
>> Input: 100-240V 50/60Hz 0.5A
>> Output: DC5.0V 2.5A
>
>
> That should be more than enough to supply the necessary 0.7A at 5VDC.

If I got right your replies, I should be able to run the LinkSys WRT54GS
wifi router using the WAPPOE power over ethernet kit, even if the power
output of the kit is 5V and the "official" power input of the router is 12V.

I just found a D-Link PoE adapter with selectable 5V or 12V power output:

"DWL-P200 Power over Ethernet Adapter"
<http://www.d-link.com/products/?pid=332>

Will it work with the LinkSys WRT54GS router?

If so, is the D-Link adapter a better product than the LinkSys WAPPOE
kit? Which one would you recommend?

Thanks a lot.

Archived from groups: alt.internet.wireless (More info?)

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 12:23:53 +0200, meATprivacyDOTnet <me@privacy.net>
wrote:

>On 10/11/04 6:46 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
>
>> I don't thin the WRT54GS will play transparent bridge. Methinks the
>> WAP54G is what you probably want. If you only want to bridge one
>> computah, then the WRT54GS at one end, and just about anything on the
>> other end, will work.

>You are right: the WRT54GS doesn't seem to support bridging with the
>official LinkSys firmware, but it looks like the unofficial Sveasoft
>firmware adds that functionality:
><http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11069890>
>
>Here is a bridging HOWTO for the WRT54G, it should work fine for the
>WRT54GS too, since the Sveasoft firmware is the basically same for both
>routers:
><http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,10682572>

I'm suspicious. Simply disabling the DHCP server and ignoring the WAN
port on a wireless router does not magically make it into a
transparent bridge. By transparent, I mean that it has a built in
protocol to duplicate the bridging (MAC to port table) on both ends of
the bridge. Without that, you can't glue two networks together and
pass multiple MAC addresses. Perhaps I missed something, but digging
through the Sveasoft site, I find no such feature described, where two
WRT54G routers are used to bridge two networks.

There was one wireless access point I played with long ago that
offered a bridging mode. At the time, transparent bridges sold for 5
times the cost of an access point, so there was quite an incentive to
advertise bridging features. However, they were apparently in a rush
and didn't do much testing. Wireless traffic seemed excessive, so I
did some sniffing and found that this was a tunnel, not a bridge. It
was passing literally everything in both directions, and not making
any decisions as to whether a packet should cross the bridge. If I
copied a file between two PC's on one side of the wireless bridge, it
would send those packets across the wireless link to nowhere.
However, it did successfully connect (not bridge) two networks.
Fortunately, that firmware mutation never hit the US market.

I really don't wanna get into the various WRT54G modified firmware
issues. I'm not a Linux expert, have only played with the Sveasoft
stuff a little bit, am a really lousy programmist, and are not
terribly interested. There are many WRT54G specific forums that are
inhabited by more experienced users that can better answer your
questions. Meanwhile, I'll just stay suspicious.

>It looks like the bridging feature is WDS compliant.

That's handy, but cuts your bandwidth in half, as does any
store-n-forward scheme.

>Do you think it will work fine and have similar performances to the WAP54G?

I have no idea. I haven't tried it. I suggest you ask in one of the
WRT54G or Linksys specific forums.

>I would like to buy the WRT54GS over the WAP54G because it has better
>hardware: faster CPU, more flash memory, more RAM ...
>
>Also, it has the SpeedBooster feature.
>
>Thanks.


--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@comix.santa-cruz.ca.us
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 AE6KS 831-336-2558

Archived from groups: alt.internet.wireless (More info?)

Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@comix.santa-cruz.ca.us> wrote in message news:<spclm096do4idq6cmn7eu4ucdi83d2qj20@4ax.com>...

> Linksys WAPPOE
> http://www.linksys.com/products/pr [...] 82&scid=38
> Note the list of supported products. I find it interesting that the
> WRT54G is supported. The WAPPOE box outputs 5VDC while the Linksys
> WRT54G allegedly runs on 12VDC. Well the answer is that the WRT54G
> will run on just about anything between 5VDC and about 18VDC.

Glad to see you noticed that, Jeff. Cool ain't it?! Linksys decided
to go from a 5V power supply to a 12V power supply so we could do POE
with no additional hardware. Way cool!

I had an old WAP11 power supply and plugged it into my WRT54G just to
see if the device would run on 5V. Did fine.

Thanks to some young EE at Linksys that nobody even noticed. Hope he
gets a promotion.