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Re: Dell is just a shitty, unethical, inefficient company  
 
yep like larry gass

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While there may be some truth to what you say, you complete lack of
any supporting facts speaks more of your being a troll than anything
about Dell.
Goodbye troll.
 
--  
Jupiter Jones
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/
 
 
"tiredofspam456" <tiredofspam456@gamezonemail.com> wrote in message
news:9b8e90f.0406180742.2e2e566e@posting.google.com...
> Re: Dell is just a shitty, unethical, inefficient company
>
> yep like larry gass

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Supporting facts?
 
Go here:
 
http://www.consumeraffairs.com/computers/computers.htm
 
 
 
 
--  
David Nimon
dnimonREMOVE@##sympatico.ca
"Jupiter Jones" <jones_jupiter@hotnomail.com> wrote in message
news:EcGAc.9888$K53.3309@edtnps89...
> While there may be some truth to what you say, you complete lack of
> any supporting facts speaks more of your being a troll than anything
> about Dell.
> Goodbye troll.
>
> --  
> Jupiter Jones
> http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/
>

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You clearly missed the point.
The OP did not give any facts, just meaningless trolling.
 
Your reference is also lacking.
Since it is geared for complaints, that is what is expected there.
Looking at a site such as that is like going to an automobile repair
shop and determining all automobiles are bad because all you see are
broke.
I place very little credibility in such sites for that and many other
reasons.
The one redeeming value of those sites is they let people let off
steam.
 
Lastly, perhaps the facts are there, what I saw was one sided stories.
Sure most are probably reasonably accurate but it is impossible to
point at a specific comment and know for a "FACT" that comment is
factual.
Thus your point is lost
 
--  
Jupiter Jones
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/
 
 
"David Nimon" <dnimonREMOVE@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
newsGIAc.56633$7H1.1866233@news20.bellglobal.com...
> Supporting facts?
>
> Go here:
>
> http://www.consumeraffairs.com/computers/computers.htm

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No, sir.........if you looked carefully, there was a tab for 'good guys' on
that site.
 
Positive experiences with vendors are logged there.
 
(Dell was NOT listed).
 
--  
David Nimon
dnimonREMOVE@##sympatico.ca
"Jupiter Jones" <jones_jupiter@hotnomail.com> wrote in message
news:7hJAc.10531$K53.4846@edtnps89...
> You clearly missed the point.
> The OP did not give any facts, just meaningless trolling.
>
> Your reference is also lacking.
> Since it is geared for complaints, that is what is expected there.
> Looking at a site such as that is like going to an automobile repair
> shop and determining all automobiles are bad because all you see are
> broke.
> I place very little credibility in such sites for that and many other
> reasons.
> The one redeeming value of those sites is they let people let off
> steam.
>
> Lastly, perhaps the facts are there, what I saw was one sided stories.
> Sure most are probably reasonably accurate but it is impossible to
> point at a specific comment and know for a "FACT" that comment is
> factual.
> Thus your point is lost
>
> --  
> Jupiter Jones
> http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/
>
>
> "David Nimon" <dnimonREMOVE@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> newsGIAc.56633$7H1.1866233@news20.bellglobal.com...
> > Supporting facts?
> >
> > Go here:
> >
> > http://www.consumeraffairs.com/computers/computers.htm
>
>

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David Nimon wrote:
 
> Supporting facts?
>  
> Go here:
>  
> http://www.consumeraffairs.com/computers/computers.htm
 
Funny, I didn't see "shitty", "unethical" or "inefficient" in the Dell  
writeup. (feel free to construe this as sarcastic)

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In article <IdOAc.17923$V57.3388915@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net>,
 Vince McGowan <SPAMvincemcg@nada.com> wrote:
 
> David Nimon wrote:
>  
> > Supporting facts?
> >  
> > Go here:
> >  
> > http://www.consumeraffairs.com/computers/computers.htm
>  
> Funny, I didn't see "shitty", "unethical" or "inefficient" in the Dell  
> writeup. (feel free to construe this as sarcastic)
 
Dell's support may be less than it used to be, but it's still rated right
at the top along with Apple. Bad support puts folks out of business, ask  
Packard-Bell.
 
email to mdell@dell.com usually gets results with a legitimate complaint.

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On 6/18/04 11:42 AM, in article
9b8e90f.0406180742.2e2e566e@posting.google.com, "tiredofspam456"
<tiredofspam456@gamezonemail.com> wrote:
 
> Re: Dell is just a shitty, unethical, inefficient company
>  
> yep like larry gass
 
Couldn't agree more.  Dell is the _WORST_ PC vendor out there.  There are
betters out there.  And this is spoken from someone with plenty of
experience in the industry...

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"Mailing Lists" <mailinglists@covad.net> wrote in message
news:BCF9DC96.845C%mailinglists@covad.net...
> On 6/18/04 11:42 AM, in article
> 9b8e90f.0406180742.2e2e566e@posting.google.com, "tiredofspam456"
> <tiredofspam456@gamezonemail.com> wrote:
>
> > Re: Dell is just a shitty, unethical, inefficient company
> >
> > yep like larry gass
>
> Couldn't agree more.  Dell is the _WORST_ PC vendor out there.  There are
> betters out there.  And this is spoken from someone with plenty of
> experience in the industry...
 
Striclly opinion based on 'your' persoanl experience.
I for example have 3 Dell 8300's and never a hiccup from any of them.
Two times I  have called Dell,  I spoke with someone courteous and was able
to quickly answer my question or take care of my request (both sales
related).
 
Now I am also a Senior Tech for a Major PC peripheral vendor whose support
center is still domestic. I have on many occasion confrenced with a customer
and their Dell support contact when working on an issue they were having. I
find Dells support reps no more lacking in experience than some of the tier
one reps (even some Tier II) within U.S. based companies.
 
Fact is that area of the world is VERY tech savvy. language, not experience
is the biggest barrier I see.

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On 6/19/04 5:51 PM, in article NB2Bc.144451$Yr.41503@okepread04, "PC Medic"
<NOT@home.net> wrote:
 
> Striclly opinion based on 'your' persoanl experience.
> I for example have 3 Dell 8300's and never a hiccup from any of them.
> Two times I  have called Dell,  I spoke with someone courteous and was able
> to quickly answer my question or take care of my request (both sales
> related).
 
I've had many no-name PC's without a hiccup, that doesn't mean all are good.
On the contrary - many are not good.
 
But from a value standpoint - Dell is bottom of the barrel.
 
Most PC benchmarks put them at or near the bottom of the barrel when it
comes to performance.  Just this July in PC Magazine, Dell's mid-top tier
laptop was the LAST PLACE IN ALL BENCHMARKS among like systems.  Their other
boxes don't do much better, barely making it into the middle of the pack.
 
Dell's reliance on Intel is also going to be their downfall when Longhorn
comes out.  After all, Intel has gotten with their pants down WRT 64-bits on
the desktop, which AMD has been working on very well for the last few years.
(Intel's first designs are copies if AMD's early 64-bit chips - this has
been verified in numerous sources).  So, when Intel comes out with a 6t4-bit
desktop chip, it will be a lackluster performer.  Perfect for a Dell box -
after all they pride themselves on selling mediocre and poor solutions.
 
> Now I am also a Senior Tech for a Major PC peripheral vendor whose support
> center is still domestic. I have on many occasion confrenced with a customer
> and their Dell support contact when working on an issue they were having. I
> find Dells support reps no more lacking in experience than some of the tier
> one reps (even some Tier II) within U.S. based companies.
 
That's nice.  Facts are I manage many many servers (30+ in my location
alone), all but 2 are IBM (2 are Dell) The IBM servers just keep running and
running without incident- I've replaced maybe 2 drives in 4 years.  The
Dells, I've lost 2 drives in 6 months and they are noisy and very poor
performers.  Needless to say anyone who uses Dell in a server role needs to
have their head examined.  They are poorly manufactured boxes.  Heck,
picking one up results in the chassis flexing and bending, something that
never happens with IBM boxes....
 
In general, Dell machines are poorly built and poor performing POS PC's.
There are far better choices out there that offer superior performance,
choice and quality.  Too bad none of those things come in a box labeled
Dell.

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I am sorry, but the "top of the pack" in which all the pack are at best
poor, really doesn't mean very much, does it?
 
 
"Robert M." <rmarkoff@faq.cIty> wrote in message
news:rmarkoff-732110.07290219062004@news04.east.earthlink.net...
> In article <IdOAc.17923$V57.3388915@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net>,
>  Vince McGowan <SPAMvincemcg@nada.com> wrote:
>
> > David Nimon wrote:
> >
> > > Supporting facts?
> > >
> > > Go here:
> > >
> > > http://www.consumeraffairs.com/computers/computers.htm
> >
> > Funny, I didn't see "shitty", "unethical" or "inefficient" in the Dell
> > writeup. (feel free to construe this as sarcastic)
>
> Dell's support may be less than it used to be, but it's still rated right
> at the top along with Apple. Bad support puts folks out of business, ask
> Packard-Bell.
>
> email to mdell@dell.com usually gets results with a legitimate complaint.

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell,alt.cellular.sprintpcs,alt.firefighters,alt.cellular.verizon,misc.emerg-services (More info?)

Mailing Lists wrote:
 
> On 6/19/04 5:51 PM, in article NB2Bc.144451$Yr.41503@okepread04, "PC Medic"
> <NOT@home.net> wrote:
>  
>  
>>Striclly opinion based on 'your' persoanl experience.
>>I for example have 3 Dell 8300's and never a hiccup from any of them.
>>Two times I  have called Dell,  I spoke with someone courteous and was able
>>to quickly answer my question or take care of my request (both sales
>>related).
>  
> I've had many no-name PC's without a hiccup, that doesn't mean all are good.
> On the contrary - many are not good.
>  
> But from a value standpoint - Dell is bottom of the barrel.
>  
> Most PC benchmarks put them at or near the bottom of the barrel when it
> comes to performance.  Just this July in PC Magazine, Dell's mid-top tier
> laptop was the LAST PLACE IN ALL BENCHMARKS among like systems.  Their other
> boxes don't do much better, barely making it into the middle of the pack.
 
That's interesting, PCWorld rated Dell Dimensions #1 (4600) & #3 (2300)  
among value systems.
 
http://www.pcworld.com/reviews/art [...] 023,00.asp
 
Dell notebooks are #3 on their Desktop Replacement list, #2 on their  
Value list and #4 on their Ultraportable list.
 
http://www.pcworld.com/reviews/art [...] 024,00.asp
 
> Dell's reliance on Intel is also going to be their downfall when Longhorn
> comes out.  After all, Intel has gotten with their pants down WRT 64-bits on
> the desktop, which AMD has been working on very well for the last few years.
> (Intel's first designs are copies if AMD's early 64-bit chips - this has
> been verified in numerous sources).  So, when Intel comes out with a 6t4-bit
> desktop chip, it will be a lackluster performer.  Perfect for a Dell box -
> after all they pride themselves on selling mediocre and poor solutions.
 
yada, yada

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"Mailing Lists" <mailinglists@covad.net> wrote in message
news:BCFA87DE.84EB%mailinglists@covad.net...
> On 6/19/04 5:51 PM, in article NB2Bc.144451$Yr.41503@okepread04, "PC
Medic"
> <NOT@home.net> wrote:
>
> > Striclly opinion based on 'your' persoanl experience.
> > I for example have 3 Dell 8300's and never a hiccup from any of them.
> > Two times I  have called Dell,  I spoke with someone courteous and was
able
> > to quickly answer my question or take care of my request (both sales
> > related).
>
> I've had many no-name PC's without a hiccup, that doesn't mean all are
good.
> On the contrary - many are not good.
 
You are correct and I did not say ALL Dells are good. I simply stated that
the original comment was "based on 'your' persoanl experience" with a Dell
purchase (which I am sure now will number in the hundreds of units).
 
>
> But from a value standpoint - Dell is bottom of the barrel.
 
Again this would be an individual opinion as consumer polls definitely
indicate otherwise.
 
>
> Most PC benchmarks put them at or near the bottom of the barrel when it
> comes to performance.  Just this July in PC Magazine, Dell's mid-top tier
> laptop was the LAST PLACE IN ALL BENCHMARKS among like systems.  Their
other
> boxes don't do much better, barely making it into the middle of the pack.
 
Being in the industry (and no I do not work for Dell), I know enough to taks
Ziff-Davis opinions at their face value. Which appears to match the value of
the ad campaign the vendor has with them!
And while my systems all bench out quite well, this thread was discussing
support quality not product quality.
 
 
>
> Dell's reliance on Intel is also going to be their downfall when Longhorn
> comes out.  After all, Intel has gotten with their pants down WRT 64-bits
on
> the desktop, which AMD has been working on very well for the last few
years.
> (Intel's first designs are copies if AMD's early 64-bit chips - this has
> been verified in numerous sources).  So, when Intel comes out with a
6t4-bit
> desktop chip, it will be a lackluster performer.  Perfect for a Dell box -
> after all they pride themselves on selling mediocre and poor solutions.
>
 
Now I understand you lack of knowledge as you are one of the close minded,
my chips better than your chip type, which again is not part of this thread.
 
 
> > Now I am also a Senior Tech for a Major PC peripheral vendor whose
support
> > center is still domestic. I have on many occasion confrenced with a
customer
> > and their Dell support contact when working on an issue they were
having. I
> > find Dells support reps no more lacking in experience than some of the
tier
> > one reps (even some Tier II) within U.S. based companies.
>
> That's nice.  Facts are I manage many many servers (30+ in my location
> alone), all but 2 are IBM (2 are Dell) The IBM servers just keep running
and
> running without incident- I've replaced maybe 2 drives in 4 years.  The
> Dells, I've lost 2 drives in 6 months and they are noisy and very poor
> performers.  Needless to say anyone who uses Dell in a server role needs
to
> have their head examined.  They are poorly manufactured boxes.  Heck,
> picking one up results in the chassis flexing and bending, something that
> never happens with IBM boxes....
>
 
Well damn you own a couple problem Dells !! I didn't realize that, I mean
this changes everything!
You have got to one of the most renound sources of Dell quality and
performance information on the planet!
I bow to you oh mighty network guy!
 
Our network runs on Dell and HP servers and never any out of the ordinary
problems.
 
 
> In general, Dell machines are poorly built and poor performing POS PC's.
> There are far better choices out there that offer superior performance,
> choice and quality.  Too bad none of those things come in a box labeled
> Dell.
 
And like I and the others out there, I guess you have your opinion.

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On 6/20/04 2:05 AM, in article
VO9Bc.30452$V57.7684783@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net, "Vince McGowan"
<SPAMvincemcg@nada.com> wrote:
 
> That's interesting, PCWorld rated Dell Dimensions #1 (4600) & #3 (2300)
> among value systems.
>  
> http://www.pcworld.com/reviews/art [...] 023,00.asp
 
From that link you'll note that no Dell was in the power PC's list.  I
wonder why....
 
> Dell notebooks are #3 on their Desktop Replacement list, #2 on their
> Value list and #4 on their Ultraportable list.
 
I feel sorry for anyone who follows that poor advice.  Dell laptops are
among the worst made out there.  Cheap plastics, keyboards that bend when
you type, etc.

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On 6/20/04 9:31 AM, in article bmgBc.145047$Yr.119932@okepread04, "PC Medic"
<NOT@home.net> wrote:
 
> You are correct and I did not say ALL Dells are good. I simply stated that
> the original comment was "based on 'your' persoanl experience" with a Dell
> purchase (which I am sure now will number in the hundreds of units).
 
Actually, no.  Where I work we unfortunately and mistakedly switched to dell
from IBM for the desktop side of things.  I feel sorry for the people who
have to use and support them.  They are in for a lot of work when the POS's
break down.  But it was management being lazy asses and wanting someone else
to track purchases which Dell agreed to do.  But the lost productivity will
be large.  IBM has the BEST corporate PC management suite out there, and
they are no more expensive than the POS Dellboxen that they order now...
 
But, where we need reliability (servers, which is my area), it will be a
cold day in HELL before we buy a DELL.  We need reliability, something they
don't offer.
 
> Again this would be an individual opinion as consumer polls definitely
> indicate otherwise.
 
More people buy GM automobiles than any other.  Would you call them good
values or excellent cars?  I think not.
 
 
> Being in the industry (and no I do not work for Dell), I know enough to taks
> Ziff-Davis opinions at their face value. Which appears to match the value of
> the ad campaign the vendor has with them!
> And while my systems all bench out quite well, this thread was discussing
> support quality not product quality.
 
It's not just them WRT benchmarks.  Tom's Hardware did a benchmark a while
(it has been a while) on OEM systems and Dell placed dead last among them.
Other magazines show a similar trend.  Dell is not a performance PC brand.
They had to stop their "xxx company uses Dell because they are high
performance PC's" advertising campaign because it was not true.
 
Dell is not a good company.  Period.  Mediocre to poor products and an
average price.  Unfortunately that sort of thing gets rewarded in the
marketplace.
 
 
> Now I understand you lack of knowledge as you are one of the close minded,
> my chips better than your chip type, which again is not part of this thread.
 
No, not really.  It's just a FACT that Intel is facing an uphill battle in
the coming months WRT 64-bits on the desktop.  What was it - 3-6 months ago
they said there was no need for it.  Now the biggest software co who's
software sells their chips more than any other says their next version needs
64-bit dual core on the desktop for best performance.  Whoops - we don't
have anything like that - Itanic's a flop, CentrinWho ain't 64 bit, the
Peee4 is at a clockspeed wall for the last 1-2 years, etc.  Whoops.  Our
competitors (IBM, AMD) have 64-bits on the desktop (G5, Athlon) and server
that often surpass the performance of our flagship chips.  Whoops.
 
Sorry, I like the best solutions - that¹s why I don't:
* Own an Intel CPU
* Run Windows (look at my headers to determine what OS)
* Tell every one to stay away from Dell
* Drive a GM product
* Buy cheap stuff - learned a long time ago you get what you pay for.
 
Maybe I'm just picky, but before I jump into something I typically do
research,  not just buy something because I see an ad on the TV (which is, I
suspect why Dell's sales are so high).
 
> Well damn you own a couple problem Dells !! I didn't realize that, I mean
> this changes everything!
> You have got to one of the most renound sources of Dell quality and
> performance information on the planet!
 
Well, when the servers are slower than similar hardware and have more
failures than similar hardware, I'd hardly call that a QUALITY solution.
Especially when they are all of the same vintage, and some of the IBM boxen
are a little older.
 
You can't build quality and reliability at Dell's price points.   You just
can't.  You can come close, but again, you get what you pay for.
 
> Our network runs on Dell and HP servers and never any out of the ordinary
> problems.
 
Define out of the ordinary.  Drive failures are not something that's
ordinary.  They should not happen in a 1.5 year old box that spent 1 year of
that turned off in a rack... Oops, that's a Dell for you.
 
> And like I and the others out there, I guess you have your opinion.
 
True.  I'd advise everyone to stay away from Dell.  You will regret it at
some point.

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell,alt.cellular.sprintpcs,alt.firefighters,alt.cellular.verizon,misc.emerg-services (More info?)

Don't feed the troll.
 
"Vince McGowan" <SPAMvincemcg@nada.com> wrote in message  
news:VO9Bc.30452$V57.7684783@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net...
> Mailing Lists wrote:
>
>> On 6/19/04 5:51 PM, in article NB2Bc.144451$Yr.41503@okepread04, "PC  
>> Medic"
>> <NOT@home.net> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Striclly opinion based on 'your' persoanl experience.
>>>I for example have 3 Dell 8300's and never a hiccup from any of them.
>>>Two times I  have called Dell,  I spoke with someone courteous and was  
>>>able
>>>to quickly answer my question or take care of my request (both sales
>>>related).
>>
>> I've had many no-name PC's without a hiccup, that doesn't mean all are  
>> good.
>> On the contrary - many are not good.
>>
>> But from a value standpoint - Dell is bottom of the barrel.
>>
>> Most PC benchmarks put them at or near the bottom of the barrel when it
>> comes to performance.  Just this July in PC Magazine, Dell's mid-top tier
>> laptop was the LAST PLACE IN ALL BENCHMARKS among like systems.  Their  
>> other
>> boxes don't do much better, barely making it into the middle of the pack.
>
> That's interesting, PCWorld rated Dell Dimensions #1 (4600) & #3 (2300)  
> among value systems.
>
> http://www.pcworld.com/reviews/art [...] 023,00.asp
>
> Dell notebooks are #3 on their Desktop Replacement list, #2 on their Value  
> list and #4 on their Ultraportable list.
>
> http://www.pcworld.com/reviews/art [...] 024,00.asp
>
>> Dell's reliance on Intel is also going to be their downfall when Longhorn
>> comes out.  After all, Intel has gotten with their pants down WRT 64-bits  
>> on
>> the desktop, which AMD has been working on very well for the last few  
>> years.
>> (Intel's first designs are copies if AMD's early 64-bit chips - this has
>> been verified in numerous sources).  So, when Intel comes out with a  
>> 6t4-bit
>> desktop chip, it will be a lackluster performer.  Perfect for a Dell  
>> box -
>> after all they pride themselves on selling mediocre and poor solutions.
>
> yada, yada
>