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Dell Latitude E6400 - Overheating and CPU throttling

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  • E6400
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Last response: in Laptop Tech Support
May 19, 2015 5:08:10 PM

Hi guys!

I have a serious problem with my Dell Latitude E6400.

Whenever I watch a Youtube 1080p video for a long time (+10 minutes), I get the CPU throttling down to 0.66Ghz. I've got a Intel Core2Duo P8400 2.27Ghz CPU, 4GB DDR2 800Mhz and Intel Familly HD video card with Windows 8.1 Pro 64 bit on it. The problem is that the thermal paste has been replaced a month ago, and the cooling system is dust-free.

Angry of the problem, I've updated my BIOS to the latest version available, and the problem got a little bit less annoying (let's say 20% improvement), but I still got a massive CPU throttling. I've downloaded RealTemp, and the problem is that, the CPU throttling is there at just 52 degrees Celsius. :( 

How could this be possible? Around 50-70 degrees Celsius, is a perfect normal temperature for a laptop under heavy load, why would it throttle at this temp?

More about : dell latitude e6400 overheating cpu throttling

a c 1019 à CPUs
May 19, 2015 5:43:40 PM

Try other temp measuring software to confirm the accuracy of RealTemp.

If you've blown the dust out and put the thermal paste on properly then it should be fine. Maybe time to re-do it. Just to make sure.
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May 19, 2015 10:43:09 PM

Thank you for your reply @i7Baby, your help means very much to me... Yes, I've downloaded OpenHardwareMonitor, and reading are 100% accurate, just like RealTemp read.

This thing has been a problem since I've bought the laptop from someone, and by replacing the thermal paste and blowing out the dust from the heatsink, I've made a small improvement (from 6-7 minutes of Full HD Youtube content, to 10+ of Youtube Full HD content), so the problem is somewhere else... I still got the CPU throttling around 52 degrees, and it goes back to normal when it hits 45-46 degrees, and the fan is running at full speed.

The idle temp is 42-43 degrees, and the fan is barely running, 44-47 degrees with normal running, and only on Full HD Youtube videos it goes to 50+, and as soon as it hits 52, it goes into CPU throttle, and as I hear it, the fan is around 80% speed (very noisy).

I have another question... My CPU is a Intel Core2Duo, P8400 2.27Ghz CPU... I've got the best price possible for a swap with the P9900 3.06Ghz 6MB cache CPU and a nVidia Quadro NVS 160M motherboard.

Would this make a good combination and solve my problem? The P8400, is always at 70-90% utilization on Youtube 1080p videos, and I think it's a little bit weak for such intensive task or multitasking in general...
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Related resources
May 19, 2015 11:15:53 PM

At least it's an upgrade over P8400, especially that it's a very good price.

What about nVidia Quadro NVS 160M? Now I have Intel Familly HD card. The Dell Latitude E6400 comes both with Intel HD and nVidia Quadro video cards. The CPU and GPU upgrade combined should be a good upgrade from what I have now, right?
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a c 1019 à CPUs
May 19, 2015 11:27:02 PM

Most laptops don't even let you upgrade - the CPUs and GPUs are soldered in.

But if you can add a graphics card and get a better CPU it will help.
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May 19, 2015 11:49:59 PM

I can replace the CPU with 3 other Intel models with the same soket as mine (2.7Ghz/2.9Ghz and 3.06Ghz model). The P9900 (3.06Ghz), is the most powerful, with just more 10W TDP.

The Intel HD Familly video card is on-board, just like the nVidia Quadro one, so I will replace the motherboard with the nVidia Quadro model.

I've listen to your advice, and open the laptop... There was barely some dust on the heatsink that was gone with just a simple air blow, and here are the performances...

Screenshot 1 - 28 minutes of Full HD Youtube content, and not a single CPU throttling (I wanted to say victory!)
Screenshot 2 - after another 3 minutes (around 32 minutes since power-on), it throttled back to 0.77Ghz (usually it throttles in 5 steps 1.89 -> 1.56 -> 1.16 -> 0.77 -> 0.66).

After I closed the Youtube page, it went back to 2Ghz+, and the temp goes back to under 45 degrees very fast... :( 

Any ideas? Can I move this throttling point to at least 55 degrees? It's very, very annoying, especially because it's a laptop, and things like cooling pad or cooling stand isn't a solution... :( 

Screenshot 1: http://s27.postimg.org/l5npvvnnn/Normal_usage.png
Screenshot 2: http://s23.postimg.org/cawffj1bf/CPU_Throttling.png
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a c 1019 à CPUs
May 20, 2015 12:34:27 AM

Try new thermal paste.
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May 20, 2015 11:12:45 AM

Ok, I'll try that @i7Baby, thank you for your help!

I have two questions...

1. If I do the CPU upgrade to P9900 (3.06Ghz), and nVidia Quadro NVS 160M, could this problem be more severe? I'm thinking that if I buy a more powerful CPU, for the same activity, it will be less load on it, and this implies less heat from it. Am I wrong? The same thing for the nVidia GPU.

2. Can the CPU throttling be moved to let's say... 55-60 degrees Celsius? I'm sure it's a perfect safe temp. Even 75-80 degrees Celsius would still be ok for the CPU, with no damage to it or other components...
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a c 1019 à CPUs
May 20, 2015 3:19:50 PM

1. shouldn't make any difference

2. CPU throttling shouldn't start till about 80C. Shutdown at 100C. Depending on the CPU.
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Best solution

a b à CPUs
May 20, 2015 6:41:05 PM

The Dell Latitude E6400 has a known throttling problem. You need to download ThrottleStop from TechPowerUp. The Clock Modulation and Chipset Clock Modulation reported on the right hand side of ThrottleStop should always be at 100%. On this Dell, I think it is the Chipset Clock Modulation throttling that will drop like a rock which kills performance. Set what ever one is dropping to 100% on the left side of ThrottleStop, put a check mark in that box and click on the Turn On button. Dell never got around to fixing this issue with a bios update. It is a problem for many of these Dells as well as many other Dell laptops from this era. Do some Google research for more info.

Edit - Here is a big download that fully explains the problem that a very similar Latitude E6500 has. ThrottleStop was specifically designed to handle these issues in this laptop.

http://www.mediafire.com/download/1gnwmozzy0w/throttleg...
Share
May 21, 2015 2:36:21 AM

Thank you very, very much for your reply, @unclewebb, it was a real help.

I am pretty good at modding, and I could try to mod the Chipset Clock Modulation with some tiny adhesive heatsinks. Could you give me a photo of those chips?

I'm downloading ThrottleStop right now. Will post the results. :) 
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May 21, 2015 4:24:16 AM

Thank you again @unclewebb, you we're a real help! IT WORKS! :D 

54 degrees Celsius CPU temp and no CPU throttling. It's perfect!

But, I still have two questions...

1. How can I make the program start at computer start-up, run minimized and not be present in the taskbar (when I use Alt+Tab, it shows up there, and if I accidentally click on it, it pops up maximized). I don't want it to be present on the taskbar, or be able to open it with Alt+Tab. If I close the program by the red X (like any other program), the CPU throttling is there, the next second. :( 

2. Are my settings for Intel Core2Duo P8400 ok? I want maximum performance on battery and AC aswell... :) 

Settings: http://s2.postimg.org/dpuoe2yax/Settings1.png
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May 21, 2015 12:43:32 PM

Can someone please reply to my latest post?

I don't know how to make ThrottleStop fully functional. :( 
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a b à CPUs
May 21, 2015 5:54:54 PM

ThrottleStop 8.00 beta 2
https://www.sendspace.com/file/b4oure

There's an updated version with a few more features.

In the Options window you have Task Bar checked. Do not check that if you do not want ThrottleStop to minimize to your Task Bar.

The ThrottleStop Guide has some information about adding ThrottleStop to the Task Scheduler so it starts with Windows.

http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/the-throttlesto...

Unfortunately all of the pictures disappeared from ImageShack. If you cannot get this figured out, let me know. There is also some more information in the ReadMe file which is included with the latest version.

Glad to hear that another Dell Latitude has been saved from the scrap heap.

I am not sure if this type of throttling is triggered by heat or by power consumption. To be honest, your temperatures seem fine. It is just bad design on Dell's part.

Be careful when using ThrottleStop when on battery power. Avoid doing any heavy duty stress tests. No battery is designed for this. For normal use, using ThrottleStop while on battery power should be OK. Uncheck BD PROCHOT. That is a signal path to your CPU. If a sensor has gone bad, it might be using that method to send a signal to your CPU which is causing throttling. Your CPU will still throttle to protect itself if it gets too hot. BD PROCHOT is completely separate from that and can be disabled.

On a P8400, you probably don't need to use the ThrottleStop - Power Saver feature. These CPUs will automatically use one of the low power C States when idle so slowing the CPU down to a crawl is usually not necessary.

You do not need to check both types of Clock Modulation. Your laptop will use either of these throttling methods but it is extremely rare for a laptop to use both methods. Only check the one that you need. The monitoring table will tell you which method your laptop is using.

You can probably drop your VID voltage down to somewhere between 1.05 and 1.10 volts. This will help reduce heat output when fully loaded. Don't go too low or your laptop will crash with a BSOD. Do some testing with Prime95 or a similar stress testing program to make sure your CPU is stable.

Edit - The last thing I noticed about your screenshot is that in the Options window at the bottom, you have told ThrottleStop to start a new copy of ThrottleStop while it is already running. Not sure what you are trying to accomplish but this is definitely a bad idea. That feature is for running programs other than ThrottleStop when you change profiles.
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May 22, 2015 5:53:57 AM

@unclewebb, you were a real help! I can't say enought to thank you!

I've posted the screenshots with the ThrottleStop 8.00 settings and screenshots from Task Schedule.

I have a question... Is it ok when my computer starts to see "ThrottleStop (32 bit)" under processes in task manager, but no icon in the notification area?

Settings: http://s9.postimg.org/qse0iqp8f/Settings.png
Tasks: http://s28.postimg.org/oawbysqj1/Tasks.png

Almost 40 minutes of 1080p content and no lag, stutter or throttling! You were my save! :D 
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a b à CPUs
May 22, 2015 3:58:30 PM

I clicked on the Task Schedule Library first and then I created a ThrottleStop task within that folder.

When using ThrottleStop, I prefer to use the Windows High Performance profile which can be found in the Control Panel - Power Options.

When Clock Modulation and Chipset Clock Mod are NOT checked, did the throttling show up in the CMod column of the data table or in the Chip column? If numbers in the CMod column were less then 100.0 then you need to check off Clock Modulation. If numbers in the Chip column were less than 100.0 then you need to check off the Chipset Clock Modulation box. You probably do not need to check both of those items but it won't hurt anything if you do. It will just waste a few CPU cycles that might be better used elsewhere.

If you are having problems with the ThrottleStop icon not showing up, make sure the task is located in the folder that I mentioned and read the included TS8 - ReadMe file. It explains how to fix that problem. Older versions of ThrottleStop were not compatible with Windows 8 but hopefully the latest version will be OK after you clean your icon cache.

I know ThrottleStop makes a world of difference on these laptops. Imagine how many of them have been scraped because of these throttling problems. I thought Dell was going to have to face a class action lawsuit but their PR department did a great job of fixing things. They told people that everything was OK and review sites never followed through to see if that was true or not. Dell also banned me from their forums to make sure that not too many people found out abut this.

Good luck with your new and improved Latitude.
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a b à CPUs
May 22, 2015 9:21:05 PM

Quote:
If numbers in the CMod column were less then 100.0 then you need to check off Clock Modulation. If numbers in the Chip column were less than 100.0 then you need to check off the Chipset Clock Modulation box.


Your picture shows 87.5 in the CMod column. That is supposed to ALWAYS be at 100.0. To fix that you need to click the top Clock Modulation box on the left hand side and make sure that is set to 100.0. Also check the Set Multiplier box. Is Windows using the High Performance profile yet? When plugged in you should definitely be using that. I use the High Performance profile even when I am running on battery power because it does not make a huge difference in power consumption. The low power C States take care of reducing power consumption no matter what profile you are running.
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May 23, 2015 4:48:08 AM

Yes, @unclewebb, I'm on "performance profile" on AC and battery aswell, and I have almost 4 hours battery life, even with ThrottleStop. :) 

Thank you for your help. :) 
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May 25, 2015 2:24:09 AM

@unclewebb, can you please tell me, if I'll buy the Intel T9900 CPU (3.06Ghz) and replace the motherboard with the one that has nVidia GPU (nVidia Quadro NVS 160M), do I still need ThrottleStop, or this is a problem just for the E6400 configuration?

Can you please tell me where is the Clock Modulation Chipset placed on the motherboard?
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a b à CPUs
May 26, 2015 2:19:01 PM

The clock modulation throttling that your laptop is experiencing is happening within the CPU. In your situation, it has nothing to do with the chipset.

No one really knows why this happens. Even when the CPU temperature is fine this can still happen. It might be triggered by some other temperature sensor on your motherboard or it might be triggered by something else like power consumption or perhaps the voltage regulator temperature. Only the engineers at Dell know why.

This is a common problem for the entire line. You might get lucky and get a good motherboard with no issues but at some point, you might have to run ThrottleStop to maintain full performance. Maybe immediately or maybe a month or 6 months from now. It depends on what type of apps you are trying to run. They more demanding the application is, the more likely that you will experience problems. Stepping up to a more powerful CPU that consumes more power and creates more heat will likely only make this problem worse.

Most owners are in the dark about this issue. When their laptop slows down to a crawl they just say, oh well, it is a laptop. I guess it is designed to only perform at this level. Too many users were willing to accept this problem so that is why it never got properly fixed. Dell did a few laptop exchanges and shipped new models to users that kept complaining. That was the cheapest way possible for them to "fix" this issue. Other people just dumped them on EBay to people that do not know anything about this clock modulation throttling issue.
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May 28, 2015 8:31:00 AM

Ok, thanks a lot @unclewebb. :) 

Do you know why 1 from 10 start-ups, ThrottleStop launches maximized and shows up in the task? Like I said, it's very rare (1 in 10 start-ups).

Thanks!
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June 1, 2015 12:45:28 AM

@unclewebb, can you please answer me the last question?
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June 2, 2015 9:19:27 AM

khrystyan27 said:
Ok, thanks a lot @unclewebb. :) 

Do you know why 1 from 10 start-ups, ThrottleStop launches maximized and shows up in the task? Like I said, it's very rare (1 in 10 start-ups).

Thanks!


Still have this problem... :( 

Need help!
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a b à CPUs
June 3, 2015 10:01:51 AM

Are you using the Task Scheduler to start ThrottleStop? That is the most reliable way to start programs with Windows. If the Task Scheduler is not set up correctly, sometimes ThrottleStop might start up before the bottom task bar exists. When this happens, ThrottleStop has nowhere to minimize to so it will probably start up maximized just so the program doesn't disappear. Here are some images of how the Task Scheduler should be setup.

Win8 TS Manual
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B0dpSo9k93jDcHk5NFA0bU...

If ThrottleStop starts up correctly 9 out of 10 times then I think you are doing pretty good. At least your CPU is finally able to run at its full rated speed.
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June 5, 2015 8:10:44 AM

Well, everything it's set up correctly, but the start-up issue is still there...

Don't know why it's doing this, but I don't think it's normal. :( 
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June 10, 2015 9:56:08 AM

Now this thing it's starting to get annoying... Am I the only one who I'm experiencing this? :( 

Now 4 out of 10 start-ups it's maximized...

Any ideea? :) 
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a b à CPUs
June 10, 2015 6:19:58 PM

Did you use the Task Scheduler? Did you highlight the Task Scheduler Library and did you create a new task for ThrottleStop in that folder? If you use Google Chrome, ThrottleStop should be in the same folder as the GoogleUpdate tasks are.

It works 10 out of 10 for me. Post some pics of how you have your Task Scheduler task set up.

Here is how it should look.

http://i.imgur.com/2ZCA8oH.png
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a b à CPUs
June 11, 2015 7:24:02 AM

I could not see your picture at tinypic.

Maybe try posting some pics at imgur.com

Tinypic is more like ad central. You can get direct links to images at imgur with zero advertising.

Upload a picture of each tab of the Task Scheduler, General, Triggers, Actions, Conditions, Settings and post another pic like I posted above that shows ThrottleStop is in the correct Task Scheduler Library.
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a b à CPUs
June 11, 2015 10:03:11 PM

Not sure if this will make any difference but on the General tab I have it set to Configure for Windows Vista, Windows Server 2008.

I do not have "Stop if the computer switches to battery power checked".

ThrottleStop was programmed with a very old version of Visual C++. I am surprised it even works in Windows 8.1 let alone Windows 10. Maybe someday ThrottleStop will be updated.

Hope your starting minimized percentage improves. At least your E6400 runs much better.
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June 12, 2015 3:53:01 PM

Well, I don't know why it's getting more f****d up, each day, but now it's starting up maximized everytime I start the computer... :( 

Don't ask what I've done, cause I didn't install or remove a program since months ago...
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June 14, 2015 2:36:05 PM

Well, I haven't seen ThrottleStop starting up maximized since 4-5 start-ups... :) )))))) I know that it's working because it's up there in Task Manager.

I don't understand anything, anymore...
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October 2, 2015 11:39:24 AM

Hey guys!

Today when I open my laptop, the ThrottleStop poped-up a message saying that "Your beta version has expired!".

What should I do?

Thanks! :) 
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October 5, 2015 3:04:11 PM

Anyone? :( 

Tonight I had a serious throttle when I was playing a game...

Looks like Throttlestop isn't working anymore. :( 
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April 30, 2016 2:33:36 PM

On windows 10, you can only disable Intel power management in registry.

Work for me on E6500.

Amazing
The same appears to occur on a fresh install of Windows 10. (Installation, boot, and windows are all slow.)



After searching all over online, I found a solution - disable the the service associated with intelppm.sys. There are 2 methods presented:

1. Edit the registry (HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\services\intelppm\Start = 4)

2. Execute "sc config intelppm start= disabled"

They both do the same thing.



After restarting the computer, it works at normal speed. Sometimes an automatic update updates the driver again and the setting needs to be changed again. There appears to be a bug in the Intel Power Management driver introduced some time after Windows 8. Windows 7 works fine even with all the windows updates installed.



For reference, the specs of this computer are:

Intel Mobile Core 2 Duo T5500 @ 1.66GHz (MMX, SSE, SSE2, SSE3, SSSE3, Intel 64, NX, VMX)

i945GM Chipset, 82801GHM (ICH7-M/U) Southbridge



I suspect that Windows is doing something SpeedStep that causes this problem. There unfortunately isn't any option in the BIOS to disable SpeedStep.



Thanks for your time.
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May 25, 2016 6:50:27 AM

Another thing, since you keep mentioning watching Youtube at 1080p. If you use Chrome, download the h264ify extension (I think there are versions for Opera and Firefox as well). It will force Youtube stream H.264 videos instead of VP8/VP9 videos which are generally more CPU and GPU demanding
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